12 Caliphs

Society Religion & Philosophy
41

Re: 12 Caliphs

^ ya sultan e madina, what "kind" of sunni are you then, i too had assumed barailvi.

42

Re: 12 Caliphs

I know Lajawab what ur saying and agreed with that, ofcourse Quran and Sunnah are what Prophet :saw: has left for in his own words. Quran is Haq and will be establish on Earth and in the hearts of millions till the final day. Only request is that when we argue or give examples to explain something, we have to be a little careful with words. Nothing to take away Quran being the light which we are told to follow but we must say that when Prophet left Quran’s value didn’t change or anything like that. The point is very clear to Muslims (majority). Abu Bakar :ra: said after Prophet passed away, that if anyone worshiped Prophet, he should know that he passed away as all human beings do, but if the worship was towards Allah, which should be, then he is there and will remain there forever. That speech gave courage to the mourners.

But again we must know in Islam the positions go like this, Allah, Prophet and Quran. So keep it simple, and others plz refrain from arguing for nothing.

43

Re: 12 Caliphs

PPL care to comment on the following

***"I am leaving among you two khalifas, the Qur'an and my Ahl-ul-bait, they will never become separate until they meet me at the pool."

*Hadith-e-Thaqalayn, the Two Weighty Things, as recorded by Al Suyuti in Tafsir Durre Manthur, Vol. 2, page 60. (sunni book)"

44

Re: 12 Caliphs

Bhai curious, do you think we don't follow Ahle Bait? We do quote Prophet's wives, Ali ra, Hasan and Husain ra. I don't think any sunni believes otherwise. If Ahle bait is what flaccy is written in your books compiled decades after ahlebait, than sorry we don't beleive in that.

If you want to keep this thread for 12 Caliphs than let just not divert it from original topic. Otherwise I will start quoting from your authentic books some quotes that no sane person will believe the words of Ahle bait. The height of Shamefullness and ignorance. Lets just not go there plz.

post pics of ur pretty hands
45

Re: 12 Caliphs

oh well…

46

Re: 12 Caliphs

Brother due to your personal fascination with haterd towards other sects you failed to understand that the thread was about 12 Caliphs and who they are? and to add to the mix I posted another hadith of Prophet about Khalifa's

"I am leaving among you two khalifas, the Qur'an and my Ahl-ul-bait, they will never become separate until they meet me at the pool."

Hadith-e-Thaqalayn, the Two Weighty Things, as recorded by Al Suyuti in Tafsir Durre Manthur, Vol. 2, page 60. (sunni book)"

I had only heard another version which uses a different word, other than khalifa, and hence I posted it in here.

I wonder why is it that since you took it as a hadith in praise of Ahl-ul-bait you got offended.

47

Re: 12 Caliphs

A little off topic (sorry).

regarding deobani and barailvi I am reading this book, Its in urdu script difficult to read at times, I would like to know your word (all the learned guys and girls here including armughal and sadia) how much authentic this material is regarding deobani and barailvi and about their sufi practices. Thanking all of you in advance for your input.

and yes i am not deobani/barailvi/shia/saudia version of islam, I don’t remember the proper name for it or any other related.

I am muslim and i know little bit about Imam Abu Hanifa.

Name of the book is:

[urdu] Taswwuf ki Haqeedat (the Reality of Soofism) by Shaikh Ataa Allah Daerwi - An authoritative book on Soofism and the Deobandi school of thought.

http://www.ahya.org/amm/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=viewdownload&cid=6

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Re: 12 Caliphs

Curiousone, I don't have hatered for other sects. Hate is a very big and strong word and I can't afford that. You can say I may have problem with a group that tries to twist the facts and believes in some very unislamic views for Ahlebait.

OK, I leave it right there.

Now since I believe in Allah, Prophet, Quran, Sunnah, Ahlebait AND also Sahaba. Am I doing right?

49

Re: 12 Caliphs

Depending on who u take islam from, what's islamic for one sect becomes unislamic for others. So the discussion should be about those specific views

50

Re: 12 Caliphs

[QUOTE]
The religion will continue to be established till the hour comes as there are twelve Caliphs over them, everyone of them coming from the Quraish".
Mishkat al Masabih: (Vol 4 p 576), Hadith 5

"The Islamic religion will continue, until the hour has been established, or you have been ruled over by 12 Caliphs, all of them being from Quraish"

Sahih Muslim, hadith number 4483

Can someone please tell me who these 12 caliphs are ?? According to Jalaudin Sayuti (Tarikh al Khulafa) there were 4 rightly guided caliphs 14 from Banu Ummaiya and 49 from Banu Abbasids. This does not add up to 12, so who are these 12 Caliphs that these ahadith are reffering to?
[/QUOTE]

12 Caliph can not be applied to the Umayad Caliphs, because
(a) they were more than twelve;
(b) they were not from the Hashimites and the Holy Prophet had said in another tradition that: "All of them will be from the Bani Hashim.
Also they cannot be applied to the Abbasid Caliphs, because they were more than twelve.
My recollection about the unfortunate history of Caliphate indicates that, even from the Sunni point of view, there was no good Caliph left after the first 4 Caliphs (It would be 5 if we include Umar Ibn Abd al-Aziz. Some Sunnis are very generous and they add Imam al-Hasan (AS) and Imam al-Mahdi (AS) to the list as well) but they were less then twelve.
As you may know, the Followers of the Members of the House of the Prophet (PBUH&HF) refer to these 12 Caliphs as of their 12 Imams starting with Imam Ali (AS) and ending with Imam Mahdi (AS) the leader of our time
. Any enemy of them not been able to find any fault in the virtues of the twelve Imams of Shi'a. Moreover these twelve Imams came one after another without any gap.

It is now clear that the only way to interpret the many traditions which are narrated by al-Bukhari, Muslim, Abu Dawud and al-Tirmidhi, al-Hakim, and Ahmad Ibn Hanbal is to accept that it refers to the Twelve Imams from the Prophet's Ahlul-Bait, because they were, in their times, the most knowledgeable, the most illustrious, the most god-fearing, the most pious, the best in personal virtues, and the most honored before Allah and Prophet; and their knowledge was derived from their ancestor (the Prophet) through their fathers. These are the Ahlul-Bait whose sinlessness, flawlessness, and purity is confirmed by the holy Quran (the last sentence of verse 33:33).
Here are thier names

          Abdul Muttalib
       __________|___________
      |                                          |
   Abdullah----------------------- Abu Talib
      |------------------------------

Muhammad (al-Mustafa)-------- |
|-----------------/--------------/
Fatima (al-Zahra)------- Ali (al-Murtadha)
|--------------------------------|
_______|________
| | /
al-Hasan (al-Mujtaba)----al-Husain (Sayyid al-Shuhadaa)
--------------------------------------/
-------------------------------Ali (Zain al-Abidin)
--------------------------------------|
------------------------Muhammad (al-Baqir)
--------------------------------------|
------------------------Ja'far (al-Sadiq)
--------------------------------------|
------------------------Musa (al-Kadhim)
------------------------------------/
------------------------Ali (al-Ridha)
------------------------------------- |
------------------------Muhammad (al-Taqi)
--------------------------------------|
------------------------Ali (al-Naqi)
--------------------------------------|
-----------------------al-Hasan (al-Askari)
--------------------------------------|
-----------------------Muhammad (al-Mahdi)