Re: 12 Caliphs
The word Quraish is already there in the fist post, looks like you have ahl e bait phobia :)
Re: 12 Caliphs
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The 12 Khalifa will be from Quraish...Not necessarily from the Ahl-e-Bait..
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Hazrat Umme Salmah(RA), Prophet's wife, narrates that she heard the Prophet(SAW) say:
The promised Mahdi will be among my progeny, among the descendants of Fatima.
(Abu Dawud, Sahih, Vol. 2, P. 207; Ibn Majah, Sahih, Vol. 2, P. 519)
Rasulullah(SAW) announced:
The Mahdi will be of my family, of the descendants of Fatima (the Prophet's daughter). (Sunan Ibn Majah, Vol. 2, Tradition No. 4086)
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Second, in the grave, in the Day of Resurrection and the hereafter, there would be two things that would matter...
1) How well you followed the Quran...
2) How well you followed the Sunnah...
These two things make up Islam and everything else is redundant...Whether 12 Khalifas or 1,200 Khalifas, in the hereafter, only Quran and the Sunnah will matter...
Innovations in Quran and Sunnah will be dealt with severely...Exclusions in Quran and Sunnah will be dealt with severely...
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Quran and Sunnah show us this way(Imam or Caliph).If we follower of Quran and Sunnah then we must need to follow Ahl-e-Bait .Without them we cant get right way and this thing is in Quran and Sunnah.
Hadhrat Abdullah bin Mas'ood(RA) reports from the Prophet(SAW), who said:
The world will not come to pass until a man from among my family, whose name will be my name, rules over the Arabs.
(Tirmidhi Sahih, Vol. 9, P. 74; Abu Dawud, Sahih, Vol. 5, P. 207;
also narrated by Ali b. Abi Talib, Abu Sa'id, Umm Salma, Abu Hurayra)
The Mahdi will be of my stock, and will have a broad forehead a prominent nose. He will fill the earth will equity and justice as it was filled with oppression and tyranny, and he will rule for seven years. (Abu-Dawud)
Re: 12 Caliphs
The Mahdi may be from the progeny of the Holy Prophet :saw: but not necessarily the Khalifas…
We don’t need to follow Ahl-e-Bait…We need to follow Sunnah as was perscribed to the Sahaba…
The Sunnah, even without the Ahl-e-Bait will remain Sunnah…The Quran, even without the presence of our Holy Prophet :saw: is still a Quran…Its importance and teachings does not change, whoever may come and go…Sunnah without the Ahl-e-Bait is still Sunnah…Its importance will remain whoever comes and goes…
Re: 12 Caliphs
please bros and sis lets not get off-topic
give your opinion on who you think are the 12 caliphs
Re: 12 Caliphs
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We don't need to follow Ahl-e-Bait...We need to follow Sunnah as was perscribed to the Sahaba...
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Ahl-e-Bait mean ghar waly(Family members) and Sahaba are those persons who sat with Holy Prophet(PBUH).Its natural family members tell us better becoz Holy Prophet brought them up and many sahaba spent thier half lives without Islam.
Hazrat Ali(A.S) is in Ahl-e-Bait and also in Sahaba so He(A.S) can guide us better sunnah then any other sahabi.
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The Sunnah, even without the Ahl-e-Bait will remain Sunnah.
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Ahl-e-Bait are part of sunnat-e-Nabvi you can see the life of Hazrat Ali(A.S) as brother of Holy Prophet(PBUH) and take care your brother.See the character of Hazrat Fatima(A.S) as daughter of Holy Prophet(PBUH) and brought up your daughters.See the Hazrat Imam Hasan(A.S) and Hazrat Imam Husain(A.S) as sons of Holy Prophet(PBUH) and guide your sons.They are all sunnah of rasul.
Re: 12 Caliphs
Lajawab sahab, chose ur words carefully plz, a person can provoke Allah’s anger. I know what ur saying and totally agree with it, but in case of Prophet :saw: tone down your voice and use appropriate words to explain ur point.
Re: 12 Caliphs
We don't need to follow Ahl-e-Bait...We need to follow Sunnah as was perscribed to the Sahaba...
...
Dont you include Bibi Ayesha in the Ahl-e-bait?
Re: 12 Caliphs
Do you remember me saying that I in any way I follow her?
Re: 12 Caliphs
What about all the ahadeeth narrated by her you dont follow them either?
Re: 12 Caliphs
Sorry if my words seemed harsh smooth guy…
You know I love the Holy Prophet :saw:…
He is the one who brought us to the True Path…He is the one who showed us Islam…He is the one who made us Muslims…It is through him that we found out how to reach the ultimate goal of every human being…
He is mercy, he is compassion, he is wisdom, knowledge and my most dearly beloved creation of all…He is my Prophet…How can I even imagine using harsh words to describe him…How can I even begin to describe him…
But you must understand what I am trying to say…The Quran was revealed to the Holy Prophet :saw:…Do you believe that after his demise, the Quran’s value has been reduced?
It hasn’t…
Similarly, the Sunnah is the second most important thing in Islam and which actually completes Islam…
These two pillars, the Quran and Sunnah, are what support the five pillars…Without the Quran and Sunnah, there are no 5 pillars…
My argument is, after the Quran, it’s not the Ahl-e-Bait that are important…It is the Sunnah, taught to the pious companions of the Holy Prophet :saw: that is important…And they, the companions 
are the ones who recorded the Sunnah as they recorded the Quran…
My point was, for your faith to be complete, for you to be a Muslim, for you to follow Islam you need two things…Quran and Sunnah in the absence of either one Islam ceases to be Islam…
And Islam is Islam and will remain Islam as long as there is the Quran and Sunnah…The Holy Prophet :saw: passed away, the Sahabas passed away, the Ahl-e-Bait passed away but Islam is still there because of two things…
The Quran and the Sunnah…
And as long as we stick to these two things, we will always be on the straight path…
May Allah :swt: give us the wisdom and the strength to stick to these two ingredients of Islam…Ameen, Summa Ameen…
Re: 12 Caliphs
I don’t follow Bibi Ayesha 
…It is the Sunnah related by her that I follow the Sunnah of the Messenger of Islam :saw:…
Re: 12 Caliphs
similarly shias follow the sunnah of the Prophet(pbuh) as narrated by the Ahl-e-Bait( as per shia defination of this term).
Re: 12 Caliphs
So that still makes the Sunnah more important than the Ahl-e-Bait, right?
Re: 12 Caliphs
Offcourse, when shias say they follow Ahl-e-bait they mean following sunnah of Prophet(pbuh) as narrated by Ahl-e-bait(again their defination). It dosent mean that they place Ahl-e-bait above the Prophet(pbuh).
Re: 12 Caliphs
Right, so the Hadith, “I leave behind me two things, the Quran and my example, the Sunnah, and if you follow these you will never go astray…” makes much more sense and holds much truer, right?
Re: 12 Caliphs
If you cannot recognize the status and importance of Ahl' al-Bayt found in both Sunni and Shi'a understanding, what do you practice the Sunnah for? Sayyidina Imam Ali (as) grew up as a young boy up to the passing of Rasul-Allah (saws) lived with him and learned directly from him (saws).
Just remember that Sunnah has not only a written tradition of memorization of his sayings, but a spiritual tradition of teaching as well.
Sunni's clearly hold fast to the Ithra (progeny) of Rasul-Allah, his Ahl' al-Bayt. I showed this here before by Imam Ahmed ibn Hanbal (r) and later Shaykh Jalaluddin as-Suyuti (r) which I've talked about this under the recent thread on Ahl' al-Bayt. Here's the saying of Imam Ahmed ibn Hanbal (r):
Ahmad bin Hanbal says in his Musnad:
Aswad bin ‘Amir has related from Abī Isrā’īl, i.e. Ismā‘īl bin Abī Ishāq Malaie, from ‘Atiyyah from Abī Sa‘īd who quotes the Prophet as saying:
“Innī tārikun fīkum al-thaqalayn, ahaduhumā akbaru min al-akhar, Kitaballāh hablun mamdudun min al-samā’-i ilā al-arz wa ‘itratī Ahl-i Baytī, wa annahumā lan yaftaraqā hattā yaridā ‘alayya al-hawz”
(I am leaving among you two precious things, one of which is greater than the other. The Book of Allah which is the rope extending from the sky to the earth and my progeny my Ahl al-Bayt. And the two will never part with each other until they return to me at the pool (of kawthar in paradise).
-Musnad, ibn Hanbal, vol. 3, p. 14.
The Hadith al-Thaqalayn has been recorded extensively in the Musnad,
e.g. vol. 3, pp. 17, 26 & 59; vol. 4, p. 367; vol. 5, pp. 181, 189, 190.
Holding fast to the Qur'an and Sunnah is not just Qur'an and the Ahadith, but also to hold fast to the prophet's (saws) progeny (descendants/family) as well. It is two-fold in sunni belief, or else Imam Ahmed (r) would have never recorded so many ahadith saying so. On top of that in the Sunni way we also hold fast to the 'ijma or consensus of the scholars.
Re: 12 Caliphs
^^
There is a reason I broke away from Barelvism…They are dangerous and have no basis in Islam as far as Quran and Sunnah are concerned…
The link has a video of what would be considered acceptable by you and other Barelvis, however I shun them…Why?
I see no mention of such practices in either the Quran or Sunnah…
I consider them innovations and innovations are hellfire…So first fear Allah :swt: then accept whatever you have been taught in the scales of Quran and Sunnah…Then proceed…Otherwise in your hurry you will do something that will take you out of Islam…All the while thinking that you are doing something good…
Re: 12 Caliphs
You're lost my man...severely lost. I am not Bareilvy, yet their Aqeedah is sound in comparison to that of Deobandi's who following Ashraf Ali Thanvi who ascribed Jism to the body of Allah subhanahu wa ta 'ala.
You should be more concerned about the beliefs of these people in the Asian subcontinent, the Deobandi's who have perverted the BELIEF of Allah (swt) in Islam.
Also keep in mind, that the beliefs of the Barelvi's whom under the guidance of Ahmed Raza Khan are mainstream widely held beliefs that are of the majority of the Muslims in the world, whether you go to al-Maghrib (North Africa), Ethiopia, Egypt, Syria, Jordan, the Caucasuses, Pakistan, India, Malaysia, Xinxiang Province of China. Are you telling me that you think that you are going to be saved from the fire and all of the Muslims who believe in such things as you do not are going to be going to the hellfire? May Allah guide you if this is what you are insinuating with such rash comments of yours.
The topic of bid'a has already been discussed numerous times. Why do you only remember the ahadith of the prophet (saws) which talk about blameworthy innovations? Why don't you talk abotu the prophet (saws) talking about the praiseworthy ones?
Anyone with an atom's weight of faith (belief in the hearts) in Allah (swt) even if they go to the hellfire first, will be purified by the fountain of life and eventually allowed to enter into Jannah, after a time in the fire. And this taking out of the fire will be done through the Shifa'a of Rasul-Allah (saws) as well.
You have no idea how much relevance the intercession of Rasul-Allah (saws) has to everything abous humanity.
You continually condemn "Barelvi's" but you have yet to provide even ONE sound scholarly article, all I've ever seen from you is a seriously confused website link that is so mixed up with different views and what not that it really has no relevance since it is completely unconstructive and does not develop a point.
Again, I will say to you that as much as you seem to believe that I am "barelvi" let me remind you that I was not even born in India or Pakistan and have never lived there. The reason why I know that what you are saying is completely irrelevant to the truth is because the beliefs which Barelvi's have are consistent with the beliefs of various Muslims and scholars I have met in teh cities of Damascus, Cairo, Aleppo, Fez, Cyprus, to the Yemen, to Uzbekistan, Chechnya.
You need to really research as to what you really know about being a Barelvi is.
Once you provide give some solid defence for your claims, then we will talk. Until then, I am going to go and get off of this computer for a break of rest. Good luck compiling something reasonable.
Re: 12 Caliphs
Also For your information, here is something that you will enjoy:
*HISAAM-UL-HARAMAIN *
34 Ulama of Makka and Medina issued the kufr fatwa on the Ulema of Deoband in 1320AH(1900 AD) and are listed below. For a detailed explanation of the fatwa read
TAMHEED-E-IMAAN **
*and *
**MUSTATAAB HISAAM-UL-HARAMAIN ALAA MANHER-UL-KUFR WAL MAIN** . **
This same Fatwa was translated and reproduced in Shaykh Hisham al-Kabbani's Encyclopaedia of Islamic Doctrine (vol. 3).
These are the Ulema:
ULAMA OF MAKKAH SHAREEF
1. Ustaad-e-Haram - Mufti Muhammad Saeed Shafe
2 Sayedul Ulama - Moulana Mufti Sheikh Ahmed Abul Khair Mirdad
3 Mufti Hanafia - Allama Sheihk Saleh Kamaal
4. Mufti - Sheikh Ali bin Siddiq Kamaal
5. Sheikud Dalail - Mufti Muhammed Abdul Haq Al-Mujahir Al-Llabadi
6. Mufti Sayed Ismail Khaleel - Librarian of Mecca
7 Allama Mufti - Saeed Abul Hoosen Al-Marzuki
8 Mufti Sheikh Abid bin Husain Maaliki
9 Mufti Ali bin Husain Maaliki
10 Mufti Muhammed Jamaal bin Muhhamed Husain
11 Mufti Sheikh Asad bin Ahmed Daha -Teacher Haram Shareef Makkah
12 Mufti Sheikh Abdur Rahman Dahan
13 Mufti Sheikh Muhammed Yusuf Afghani
14 Mufti Sheikh Ahmed Al-Maaliki Al-Imdadi - Brother in Tariqat of Ashraf Ali Thanwi, Rashid Ahmed Gangohi and Khalil Ahmed Ambhetwi
15 Mufti Muhammed Yusuf Al-Khayaat
16 Sheikh Muhammed Saleh bin Muhammed Ba-fazal
17 Sheikh Abdul Karim Naji Dagistani
18 Sheikh Muhammed Saeed bin Muhhamed Al-Yamani
19. Mufti Sheikh Haamid Muhammed Al-Jadawi
ULAMA OF MEDINA SHAREEF
20 Mufti Hanafia - Tajuddin Liyas
21 Mufti of Madina - Allama Osman bin Abdus Salaam Dadistani
22 Sheikh-e-Maalikia - Mufti Sayed Ahmed of Algeria
23 Mufti Khaleel bin Ibrahim Karbooti
24 Shaikhud Dalail - Mufti Sayed Muhammed Saeed
25 Mufti Sheikh Mehmood bin Ahmed Omari
26 Shaikhud Dalail - Mufti Sayed Abbas bin Sayed Jaleel
27 Mufti Skeikh Omar bin Hamdaan Al-Maharasee
28 Mufti Sayed Hakeem Muhammed bin Muhaamed Madani
29 Mufti Sheikh Muhammed Kiyan - teacher Haram Shareef Madina
30 Mufti Shafaeiya - Allama Sayed Shareef Ahmed Barzanji
31 Mufti Muhammed Aziz Maaliki - of Tunisia
32 Mufti Sheikh Abdul Qader Taufeeq - Teacher Masjid-e-Nabawi Shareef