Re: Why can’t you criticise
This could well be a conspiracy theory.If it was right,how on earth would the intelligence service apparatus sit `ducks’ on such a move?Moreover do you think ,if at all, it had been a closely guarded secret,how would it have been held so secret for almost 11 years,from 1960-1971?
Re: Why can’t you criticise
Again,in the long term,a two Pakistan theory was not going to be a pragmatic one in a long run.The break-up was inevitable eventually,whoever played role in that.
Re: Why can’t you criticise
This one is going to over time. A cliffhanger
Re: Why can’t you criticise
Read Punjabi writers like Afzal Tauseef, Fakar Zaman, Hanif Ramay and they will tell you that how they feel loss of their language. decision to join Pakistan by all units including Punjab was not at the cost of shunning their language and identities. While Punjabi literature flourish in India, its not the case in Pakistani Punjab. I do agree with your comments and the thought of Punjabi intellectual that Punjab was mostly affected of partition and in return it only got blames just because of few people who are also exploiting Punjabi masses todate.
Giving status of Official or national language to any language does have an impact on its society. Afzal Tauseef (famous Punjabi writer mostlu unknown to Punjabi generation even after writing more than 25 books ranging from poetry to politics) once interviewed Akbar Bugti (then CM Balochistan) and offered him her books, including a book in Punjabi. When she asked him ‘Do you know how to read Punajbi?’. He replied ‘Main koi Punjabi hoon jo Punajbi na paRh sakoon’. so this was / is the sorry state of Punajbi in Pakistan. Not that I’ve just concern for Sindhi only, I want to see language of Waris Shah and Bulleh Shah flourish everywhere, not only in Punjab but also in other parts of Pakistan as well.
Now certain question for you?
Why do you think it a blasphemy to talk about mother tongue? Why it has been a factor for weakening national unity from first day of Pakistan? Why talking about ones mother tongue is consider an attack on Urdu? Do you really consider Urdu as fragile as it is being portrayed against other languages?
How do you see a British leader’s statement during World War II that ‘Britain can’t be destroyed. British ladies and English will save it’? Don’t you think that its a child’s personal right to learn, speak , read his / her mother tongue without any complex?
If there is no issue to declare regional language as official / national languages, why Bengalis have to run a movement for ten years and Sindhis are still struggling for the same?
PS: If I have thrown deeply flawed arguments then I’m sorry to say you are also writing these comments under a self-perceived patriotism which comes at the cost of denying mother tongue.
Re: Why can’t you criticise
Sindhi is official language of Sindh? Please elaborate.
If Sindhi is being taught and used as medium of instructions in rural Sindh, it came at a cost after long struggle. Otherwise, just go to Nadra offices in Karachi and get a CNIC in Sindhi, which will let you know the reality. Railway Station names in Sindhi were wiped out and students all across Sindh had to come on roads to get it re-written. Currently, PTV Karachi is closing one hour Sindhi transmission (though we don’t need this having more than a dozen Sindhi channels on satellite), but this all attitude raise a question. Why so much hatred for regional languages?
Re: Why can’t you criticise
Let me remind you that this thread was not about thorough discussion on history. You asked me reference, I reproduced it. You questioned my source of information, but didn’t talk about general attitude of discouraging question, imposing decisions against masses wishes. Don’t you think these actions create resentment among victims of such actions? Bengali language issue was resolved in 1956, but how and after adopting which route? Why we don’t learn to acknowledge our languages without bloodshed?
I din’t deny it. My point was general attitude of imposing unwanted decisions.
Thanks for acknowledging it and confirming it.
Seriously speaking:
Not the reason, but it is precedent for not raising questions and going against the wishes of masses. Don’t you think that dictatorial style of leadership (without considering the masses requirement) lead to resentment. Remember what happened to Mr Jinah in Dhaka University in 1948?
Shaheed Monument in Dhaka university kept reminding Bengalis about the struggle they had to gone through upto 1956. Even after 1956, Bengali language seen a step of banning Tagore on Radio Pakistan, which is again a language related issue. Such abrupt decisions were easy to taken as there was a history of imposing decisions forcefully.
Agree. Add role of Pakistan army who killed so many Bengalis (may be on Bhutto’s orders) in early 1971.
Re: Why can’t you criticise
mere jaan ke totay:
Waqt karta hy parvarish barson!
Hadsa aik dam nahi hota!
Re: Why can’t you criticise
Jeenay ke vanje
haath pakdkar chalata hain humko.
Re: Why can’t you criticise
It was not just about cautioning business community. Haroon being from influential business family and editor of Dawn gave comments to President of Karachi Chamber that ’ Bengalis have nothing common among us except religion and they are bound to separate from us’. This was coming from Editor of Dawn, which was very much vocal against Sindhi Hindus and played important role in their exodus form homeland. Look the bizarre attitude. 15-20 years ago religion was the binding force to achieve a separate country and after that it became only common factor which was weak to keep masses united.
But its not just about founding leaders who should be criticised for their actions and imposed decision, our masses are equally corrupt. Masses who still worship Bhutto, masses who remained silent when Butcher of East Pakistani (Bengalis) Tikka Khan was made governor of Punjab by daughter of east in 1988. Making Zardari a president and following likes of Altaf Hussain got a historic pattern in Pakistan. dhitai ki koi had nahin.
Re: Why can’t you criticise
Existing as two nations under the same banner was always going to be difficult but there are certain factors contributed to the disintegration.I believe West Pakistan could not effectively rein in Mr.Suharawardi initially (he was literally sowing the seeds of a sense of different identity among Bengalis),then the fatal error of not acknowledging Mujib’s electoral victory in the East .Gen.Tikka Khan’s `Operation Searchlight’ was yet another blunder when the army butchered scores of intellectuals that alienated the whole of Bengalis.
I would still believe that Pakistan committed a fatal error by abetting unrest in Kashmir ahead of 1965 war by sending insurgents in to the valley because this had prompted India to take similar measures in the East Pakistan a few years later.Remember R.A.W was formed only in 1968 but it would be the watchful eyes of Mr.Kao that led to the abetting of Mukti Bahini.
Re: Why can’t you criticise
Preservation and promotion of regional languages is an all valid and a welcoming debate. But it does not have to be propagated at the expense of trumping Urdu language, or tempering history and discrediting ‘so called’ founding fathers to push the agenda.
Yes, it is increasingly surprising that despite Punjabi being the biggest victim of Urdu’s dominance, Punjabis for most part haven’t developed any victim complex. One of those many things that make me respect and appreciate Punjabis even more. Maybe it’s about time for half of Pakistan - Punjab - to learn a hissy fit and get their language the status of national language. Why should they accommodate Urdu in their province? Time to rebel and struggle.
Now certain question for you?
Not it has not been a factor behind weakening national unity. You had already tried to lump the blame of separation of East Pakistan on Urdu language, and this argument has already been successfully debunked in this thread. Let’s not go back to that. Urdu is the Lingua Franca of Pakistan, in an ethnically diverse country like Pakistan, it bridges a gap between communities. There are forty different spoken languages in Pakistan. Do you expect Pakistanis to know all forty languages? Should people of Punjab only dare step into Pakhtoonkha if only they can speak Pashto? Would Sindhis only welcome people in their province on condition that they speak perfect Sindhi? Indeed, that is exactly why no one should underestimate the importance of Urdu language in shaping Pakistan. This beautiful language is part of every Pakistani’s identity today. Yes, divide and rule politics is still alive in Pakistan and India, ethnic inferiority is still rife and xenophobia still sells in ‘many parts of Pakistan’. Any Tom, Dick, Harry who wants his fifteen minutes of fame and wants to stir emotions, he/she pulls the language and ethnic card.
Who was that leader? Despite all the attempts made by French for many century, by twentieth century the British were successful in making English the Lingua Franca of the world. It’s supremacy and reach wasn’t going to be easily replaced.
But was it also saying to suggest all English speaking colonies and ex-colonies turned de facto allies (i.e America, Canada, Australia, New Zealand) will save Britain from fascist Germany? Or was he suggesting that English had successfully sealed its position as the language of knowledge, language of science, language of intervention, language of enlightenment, language of Protestantism, language of modern civilisation, language of peace, language of war, and language of diplomacy that Britain’s cultural hegemony was not threatened by rise of another European power.
The bolded paragraph is like music to my ears. It’s so wonderful to know Sindhis are at least ‘struggling’ for something, anything. The situation is not so hopeless after all. In 21st century, in an nuclear armed country, the district of Tharparkar (Sindh!) resemble a desolate African colony with annual famine. But I’m delighted to know Sindhi are ‘struggling’ for their language at least.
In Pakistan, yes there is indeed an issue to declare languages as ‘national’. It was possible in East Pakistan because it was geographically detached from Pakistan, it was one socially and ethnically cohesive unit with 99% of population speaking the same language, the decision was lot easier to make. Why it was delayed was due to the reason that if the change of language demand is approved for Bengalis, then all other ethnic units may demand the same. Pakistan was a young country at that time, and it desperately needed a binding medium to bring communities together.
LOL. Please don’t try this in front of me. Thank you very much but my mother language in Punjabi and I’m proudly trilingual. I don’t need justify or prove either my patriotism or love for my mother tongue to you.
Re: Why can’t you criticise
I think you got comprehension problems or may be you don’t understand what I wrote. Refer my first post where I said actions of imposing a decisions (example language) and not allowing people to question certain decisions made mess of this country. Where did it say that Urdu was the reason for disintegration. There is a hell difference what you understood and what I wrote.
As far as Sindhi history of struggle is concerned, its very much there in the form of MRD and one-unit. I have explained it you another thread nd there is no need to come up with taunts. We know that Tharparkar issue needs attention and people are talking about it, but maladministration of Sindh government’s part should not put as a failure of Sindhi society in totality.
In last, I don’t have any issue with Urdu and its promotion as lingua franca, but the way it was imposed on other languages do have an impact on the psyche of those whose languages were suppressed. If Punjab denounced its langauge and did not struggle to make it medium of instruction (or ven a translation of Quran), it doesn’t mean that it bounds other people to shun their languages. To each their own.
Re: Why can’t you criticise
Ah the good old ‘you have comprehension problem’ retort. It’s a classic come back in internet world, isn’t it?
But yes of course my comprehension has taken a real toll because of your constant flip flopping and incoherent arguments. In the name of history, you have churned out the age old propaganda that Bangladeshi separatist campaign emerged because of the language. In your own words, you called approval of Urdu as a national language as ‘fatal mistake and a proven wrong decision in the long run’. In fact, the proper history suggest that when the fatal episode actually happened or started happening, the language issue was no where to be seen nor it reemerged when Bengali rebellion was at its peak.
However, you still tried to justify by saying that a debate leading up to 1956 left a ‘bad taste’ in Bengalis’ mouth, therefore fifteen years after settling the issue peacefully they randomly decided to separate because somehow they were still unhappy? Your posts for most part tried to propagate romantic sophistry and disregarded the profound economic inequalities, political suppression, structural power struggle, lack of adequate representation that truly proved to be ‘fatal’ decisions. If one really wants to talk to about what proved to be fatal decisions in Pakistan, then let’s be honest about it. Maybe your intention wasn’t to distort history, but you did put a very shoddy argument forward.
In a country (or province) where basic literacy rate is so severely low and people’s access to basic necessities for survival (not even for decent living) is a picture of epic embarrassment, and in that case for all arm chair intellectuals and hopeless romantics to throw tantrums about language is pathetically comical in my view. But like I said before, unfortunately, in Pakistan people’s psyche is forever plagued by either misplaced pride in ethnicity or self invented religiosity.
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i lived in karachi and I had to learn sindhi in school. That is another issue if the teachers were good and if I learned much from their scholarship, but that is another topic for education in pakistan.
Now you are being just unfair and digging up old nationalistic qadir magsi type grievances. Fine, lets make it an official language of Pakistan, so then what is next? We make forms and currency in sindhi err have sindhi on it like india does? but where does it stop. See, issues like these is what stops provincial autonomy or what I would like, smaller and multiple provinces in Pakistan.
Now, you can have sindhi as a medium of instruction (it is in interior sindh, isn’t it???) and people can be bi- and tri-lingual but how many people languages would people have to learn? I know about how children can learn 3 languages if taught from childhood, but Pakistan has numerous languages, SO WHY SHOULDn’t a sindhi learn sindhi, pashto, balochi, bruhuwi, punjabi, urdu AND english (don’t want to skip the official language of Pakistan)… 
Re: Why can’t you criticise
peacefully resolved. hahaaha. Now Shaheed Monument in Dhaka University will mock this assumption. Do you know when world mother tongues day is celebrated and what is the link of that day with Shaheed Monument. Go figure.
As far as distortion of history and disregarding inequalities with Bengalis, where did I do so. I have given so many clarifications and acknowledged resolution of language issue in 1956. What we are not agreeing is whether this resolution cleared all the back log in Bengali memory when subsequently Radio Pakistan put a ban on their poet Tagore. I feel that that movement and monument became a symbol for their struggle against the western part and its atrocities. You got all the right to disagree with it as its a subjective matter.
As far as literacy rate in Sindh is concerned, we want it to increase it through our mother tongue and we have developed our language to the extent that we can use it as medium of instruction at least upto class 10. We feel pride in doing so, if other consider it racism, be it that.
Now coming to the original point of thread (as we have run around some incidents in all this debate), don’t you think that Mr Jinah’s decision for transferring Sindh’s funds to Kashmir war in 1948 instead of using that for education and health was wrong? What about the insistence of Liaquat Ali Khan of transferring Sindh’s capital to Hyderabad (after the province consumed all its sources in rehabilitation of Muslims from UP and other parts of India and giving remaining funds to Kashmir war cause)? Were these actions justifiable and we will say yes to these because there involves our founding leaders?
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Its not about digging up grievances, because these grievances are still there and frequently parties (you mentioned) exploit this sentiment. Why not seriously discuss and resolve it once and for all.
I don’t think that getting regional languages status of official / national language means that every one will need to learn all these languages. I have same concerns for Urdu and its promotion as well. Its just a tag that Urdu is our national language. Official records are in English and Urdu has not get the proper attention it deserve being a single national language. I also want to understand why people struggle for getting their mother tongues as national language, when a foreign language is used officially. I do want to understand that what is the need of 14 official languages in India and how do to it help those languages. But here my question is different. If the observation in OP is correct, can such acts be justified?
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Apologies. I meant peaceful in a sense that it didn’t call upon an all out separatist campaign and a bloody war. The issue was eventually settled politically, despite the shooting at the protesters. It’s like if the current government agrees to PTI’s demands for electoral reform, people will hardly remember the protesters who lost their lives during Islamabad crackdown. It’s an unfortunate, but that’s the trouble with brevity as it’s often built upon dangerous simplicity.
But coming back to your original point, forgive me that I am neither a self indulgent nationalist with any chip on my shoulders nor I suffer from any identity complexes of any kind nor I hold any kind of internalised resentment for the* ‘so called founding fathers’* that I must put them on the blast to give myself a congratulatory pat on the back for breaking some sort of tradition. For sake of history, I genuinely believe the decision they took at the time were in best interest and they made complete sense under the circumstances which they came about. You are looking for an excuse to put ‘so called founding fathers’ on a blast, while I can provide a critique on their decisions, measure its success and failures without running any campaign to belittle people behind those policies. But at the rate you are going, you might as well blame Jinnah for making Pakistan because of his stupid decision, poor old Sindh lost all its Hindu teachers at the time of partition hence the reason why for past whopping 68 years, Sindh’s literacy rate has been in a permanent state of decay. Someone’s got to take the blame.
However, to answer your question, Jinnah made an awful mistake of robbing poor Sindh’s budget because he literally thought he would win Kashmir. The war will be over, Kashmir will be with Pakistan and Sindh will get a new budget. Poor old ailing man didn’t have the luxury of having a crystal ball in his hand to learn that the Kashmir war won’t be won even 68 years after his death. Speaking of crystal ball, I don’t even think he would’ve bothered inventing Pakistan had he knew what a confused, bitter, self interested and self destructive bunch would eventually inhabit that country and turn the dream into a nightmare.
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I got my answer, why can’t we talk on these issues. 