Whats the deal with this?

Society Religion & Philosophy
21

PA,

[quote]
Originally posted by PA:

** Hasnain have you checked the mail lately for your reality check?? why were the 2nd, 3rd and 4th caliphs murdered in cold blood?? because there were no differences in Islam at that time cuz everyone followed the Prophet and the 'rightly guided companions'??**
[/quote]

Firstly, these difference were not religious, but political. And secondly, much of it was done and influenced by the enemies of Islaam and the hypocrites, who clearly are not the Companions.

Anyway, how do you know they were murdered? I thought you never relied upon historical texts dating back to the Companions, which is why you reject ahadeeth! Perhaps you need that reality check more than I do!

[quote]
Orignally posted by PA:

** Why do people who follow one companion differ with the other.. why is there a need to follow 'Imams' then if everything from the companions is a clear explanation.**
[/quote]

This statement alone proves that you know next to nothing about Islaam. Who said anything about jurisprudence differences? I’m speaking of even more fundamental than that: the crux of the Religion, the very reason why jinn and mankind were created; why all the Prophets were sent; and the basis of Islamic creed – Tawheed and ‘aqeedah. We must base our understanding of this, first and foremost, on that of the Companions. And this is something they never differed over and were in unanimous agreement, just like the 4 Imaams and the righteous predecessors after them.

[quote]
** why today you still need to go 'fatwa-shopping' when trying to decide if wearing nail polish while offering Salat is permissible??**

Nail polish is fine while performing salaah, just as long as it was not worn while making ablution/wadhoo.

Did you know that the second pillar of Islaam is salaah? And did you know that Allaah created jinn and mankind for no other purpose except to worship Him alone? And do you know that a part of worship is salaah/prayer/namaaz? And did you know that if you do not pray, you are not fulfilling purpose of your creation? And did you know that a condition of prayer is ablution/wadhoo? And did you know that the prescribed body parts have to be wet for your wadhoo to be correct. And did you know that if your wadhoo is not correct you have not fulfilled the condition of prayer?

If you knew all this, then you’ll know that making ablution while wearing nail polish means that the water cannot reach the nails, which means that your wadhoo is void, which means that you have not fulfilled the condition of prayer, which means that your prayer is invalid, which means that you have neglected the reason for your existence, which means that you haven’t fulfilled the purpose of your creation.

… as simple as that.

"No leaf falls except that He knows of it, and no rain drop forms except that He has willed it."

22

Husnain, you are a jackass. He called himself Ghulam Ahmad, because that was the name given to him by his parents. He could have been Mark Soodenburg. Get out of the hole of your Shiekh.

23

Regardless, it doesn't make sense for a masiah or a prophet to have a name that has a shirk element attached to it.

How about answering the rest of the questions, as you seem so sure of yourself?

You and monad must be twins ... you share the same 'insecurity' and emotional instabilities ...

"No leaf falls except that He knows of it, and no rain drop forms except that He has willed it."

24

Husnain,

The movement that proves from Quran & Bible that Jesus, whom the majority of British consider son of God, is dead; the movement which has solely converted millions to Islam in Christian states of Africa & Christians missionaries over there consider the movement a serious threat, the one movement whom in the whole Islamic history has published literature & Quranic translations in nearly all European languages ... etc ... you consider them agents of the British. Sure!

You are more than welcome to come to the US & I will be happy to show you around. Though you can investigate in England as well. Afterall Ahmadis are truly British agents then why not catch them red handed. :~) There we have mosques in nearly all major cities & you can walk in without any hesitation!

25

Husnain, let others decide who is insecure. I can understand if there are theological differences between interpretations, but which idiot will go to tiniest of details such as his “name” to prove their point? Beat the hell out of me. It is like saying George Bush has a Christian name, hence he must hate Iraq. You have no clue Husnain.

The reason I didn’t bother answering your other questions is because you don’t know what you are talking about.

please tell everyone how old must a religion be in order for it to be considere 'true', the question Chaltahai asked.

26

If it is a religion based on the Qur'aan then it must be no less than 1400 years old.

George Bush never claimed to be mesiah/prophet of God!

[quote]
The reason I didn’t bother answering your other questions is because you don’t know what you are talking about.
[/quote]

Ha! what a kop-out!

"No leaf falls except that He knows of it, and no rain drop forms except that He has willed it."

27

If it is a religion based on the Qur'aan then it must be no less than 1400 years old.<<<

Husnain, you just said that Mohammad (pubh) was a phony prophet. Shame on you.

28

Why don't you open another thread, and we'll see exactly how much of a shame it is on me?

"No leaf falls except that He knows of it, and no rain drop forms except that He has willed it."

29

No need to open another thread, when you open your mouth with comments like “1400 year old”, you make a royal fool of yourself. You basically implied (unintendedly) that the first 1399 years of Islam were false. I know you didn’t mean to say that, but most things you say, you have no clue to begin with.

Try explaining your logic about the above comment in this thread.

30

Husnain, on the name issue, I have heard this objection in many different forms. Some object at Ghulam, some at Ahmad .. I have a Shia friend who is not willing to accept anyone as Imam Mahdi unless his name is Muhammad Ahmad & parents name Amina and Abdullah! Oh well.

Ghulam is a pretty common name in Pakistan and in Punjab. I guess you haven't heard of the name of the third governor general of Pakistan, Ghulam "Muhammad" or the more recent one Ghulam "Ishaq" Khan .. or are they all are following the wrong Islam & are bound to hell?

According to the sunnah of AnHazoor (saw) the name Abdul must accompany name of Allah, otherwise its not a appropriate. Like you can have Abdul Baqi, Abdul Qadir etc but never hear anyone named Abdul Ahmad or Abdul Musa.

I think its a pretty appropriate name as he claimed to the perfect follower of AnHazoor (saw) and considered him his master. And being the Ghulam of Ahmad-e-Arabi (saw) he claimed to be the Messiah and so he named his jama'at Ahmadi. It also ties into the interpretation of the concept of barooz directed to the early verses of Surah Jummah, but that will be taking the discussion a little too deep.

31

Hasnain

I've got no problem accepting Mirza Ghulam Ahmed as an impostor.

I don't believe he was the Mehdi, Messiah, Reformer, Prophet etc etc and never will.

If Ahmedies accept A'Hadeeth, then they will know that he does not fit the criteria, as prophecised by Muhammad SAW and if they don't accept A'Hdaeeth, then they fall into the same category as Rishaad/Rasheed, founder of the Sumbitters.

I've had plenty of 'debates' with Ahmedjee and NYAhmadee and I'm sure they are aware of my stance.

No apologies from my end, just the truth.

32

You guys should really be ashamed of yourselves. The topic got winded onto a totally different track. If you've got nothing positive to say, other than ahmedy-bashing, or sunni-bashing, or whatever it is that gets you all excited, then you ought to just open a separate thread on it.

This thread is about what scratch stated, and lets just focus on that.

Thank-you!

33

I thought I had heard said that Islam is as old as the hills, but is believed to have been tarnished over time. I thought Muslims believed this. I have serious trouble seeing the Torah as a work that contradicts any relationship with God. It shows the descendants of Abraham, warts and all. In fact, this text is most honest. Besides being a theological work, it is a story of a group of tribes who went to a promised land to become a nation.

34

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Hasnain: *
Firstly, these difference were not religious, but political. And secondly, much of it was done and influenced by the enemies of Islaam and the hypocrites, who clearly are not the Companions.
[/quote]

I'm sorry, I didn't know the Islamic Republic at that time was secular.

[quote]
Anyway, how do you know they were murdered? I thought you never relied upon historical texts dating back to the Companions, which is why you reject ahadeeth! Perhaps you need that reality check more than I do!
[/quote]

if you spent more time reading my posts then deleting them you'd realize by now that I reject the hadith as a source of Islamic law. I read it just like any other history book with the same skepticism, scrutiny and a need of constant cross checking

[quote]
We must base our understanding of this, first and foremost, on that of the Companions. And this is something they never differed over and were in unanimous agreement, just like the 4 Imaams and the righteous predecessors after them.
[/quote]

Once again Hasnain, which companion?? there were so many of them. And that's precisely what happened.. people started following people, instead of reading the revealed text and understanding themselves.

[quote]
Nail polish is fine while performing salaah, just as long as it was not worn while making ablution/wadhoo.
[/quote]

isn't this a fatwa on your part, or a rehash of somebody elses fatwa.. aren't there opposing views to the above statement?

[quote]
Did you know that the second pillar of Islaam is salaah? And did you know that Allaah created jinn and mankind for no other purpose except to worship Him alone? And do you know that a part of worship is salaah/prayer/namaaz? And did you know that if you do not pray, you are not fulfilling purpose of your creation? And did you know that a condition of prayer is ablution/wadhoo? And did you know that the prescribed body parts have to be wet for your wadhoo to be correct. And did you know that if your wadhoo is not correct you have not fulfilled the condition of prayer?

If you knew all this, then you’ll know that making ablution while wearing nail polish means that the water cannot reach the nails, which means that your wadhoo is void, which means that you have not fulfilled the condition of prayer, which means that your prayer is invalid, which means that you have neglected the reason for your existence, which means that you haven’t fulfilled the purpose of your creation.

… as simple as that.
[/quote]

once again you miss the boat.. if you had read the Qur'an and were not blindly following the whims of 'scholars'. you'd realize that wadhoo is not to 'make water reach your nails' but to 'purify us'. ..

Continue denying the fact that modern Islam is based more on interpretations of scholars and maulvis than a real following of the revealed text... do not give me the companions argument because you cannot even bring a unanimously agreed upon version of the last sermon, let alone the thousands of topics as discussed in that literature which constitutes your religion for you.