[quote]
Originally posted by a1shah:
** Changez,
....
Your foundation is weak, yr logic muddled. Go now, play with yr hindu friends.**
[/quote]
so you basically wanted to avoid my questions and beat about bush?
We oughta be Changez like, don't we?
It pains me to see all shias being so vindictive. You guys are acting as if Islam's message would have changed had Hazrat Ali(RA) become the 1st Caliph, you guys surely act like it.
Everything shias have displayed on this forum leeds me to believe in shiaism as a sect whose basis stem from hate and prejudice putting it as far away from the teachings of Mohammed(SAW) as possible, kinda like the People that follow Elijah Mohammed who really believe in white hate and black supremacy which in a shia's case would be hate everybody non-shia.
[This message has been edited by zman (edited August 29, 2001).]
[quote]
Originally posted by wasir:
**hello hello...here are some answers for your childish questions ........
**
[/quote]
So it means those who weren't born in Kabah were less respectful....if so then what about Prophet(Peace be upon him) where was he born?>>>>>>>>>
I was comparing only three khalifas of muslims. But....
You would have never asked me this question, had you known the status of MY Rasool pbuh.
My Rasool's status is higher than anybody. MY Rasool pbuh was There when prophet Hazrat Adam a.s was being created with clay. My Rasool pbuh was There when Prophet Ibrahim a.s was raising the walls of KABA. My Rasool pbuh was the witness on all ~123999 prophets.
<<<<<
A person who was the first Muslim to pray behind My Rasool pbuh for seven years before anybody else and was raised by MY Rassol pbuh since infancy is by GOD better than any of the sahabas.
We Sunnis don't put any comparison between Sahabas that who was better and who wasn't>>>>>>>
You Don't?????
Think again!!!!!
Read the very first sentence of the very first post of this thread. Zein wrote:
"The Shaikhayn, i.e. Hadrat Abû Bakr and Hadrat ’Umar ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anhumâ’, are the highest ones of the Ashâb-i-kirâm"
You Don't stop here, You people go to the next step and Say things about Rasool pbuh Ahlulbait a.s like Zein wrote above:
"And there are just so many things ur 12 so called miserable miscreants Imams have made up"
[quote]
Originally posted by zman:
**
**
[/quote]
You guys are acting as if Islam's message would have changed had Hazrat Ali(RA) become the 1st Caliph, you guys surely act like it.>>>>>>>>>>
Yes you are absolutely right. Had the bani ummaya listened to the Rasool pbuh we would not have 72 sects in islam, we would have been the strongest in the world. We would not have the twisted hadees like Allah has legs that he will lower in Hell to cool it down (n.b) etc etc.....
Yes. It took Imam Husain and his 72 companions to correct what your Khalifatul muslaimeens(mauwia and yazid)had done to the Islam.
leeds me to believe in shiaism as a sect whose basis stem from hate and prejudice >>>>>>>
NO it is not true.... we are following surat Al-asar... we are preaching HAQ. thats all.
[quote]
Originally posted by zman:
**It pains me to see all shias being so vindictive. You guys are acting as if Islam's message would have changed had Hazrat Ali(RA) become the 1st Caliph, you guys surely act like it.
Everything shias have displayed on this forum leeds me to believe in shiaism as a sect whose basis stem from hate and prejudice putting it as far away from the teachings of Mohammed(SAW) as possible, kinda like the People that follow Elijah Mohammed who really believe in white hate and black supremacy which in a shia's case would be hate everybody non-shia.
[This message has been edited by zman (edited August 29, 2001).]**
[/quote]
.. yes they worship personalities not the message of Islam.. In fact noone is important in Islam than Prophet Muhammed and he forbid to make a single pic of himself since his mission was to convey the message og God..and look how shias have signs everywhere..
hate is the foundation stone in these shia posts.. but with the grace of Allah Islam is florishing all over the world as its not dependent upon personalities and who became khalifa or imam at particular time is not at all important.. its the messgae which spread nicely in early era after Prophets death..
[quote]
Originally posted by Degas:
.**
[/quote]
.. yes they worship personalities not the message of Islam..<<<<<
Really ??????
look how shias have signs everywhere.<<<
Yes! we do. All of our mosques are a sign(shabhee) of Kaba shareef.We consider them Allah's House, But we pray towards Kaba not towards mosques, because Mosques are signs only not kaba shareef... are your mosques not sign of Kaba shareef?
[This message has been edited by hello hello (edited August 29, 2001).]
hello hello,
..u knew well what was I saying..
carrying and performing a sajda to a piece of rock or clay.. thinking thta one is bowing to a piece of land in Karbala..u have made great sacrifice of Hazrat Hussain (R.A) into fantacy.. carryinh a horse and making tazias .. depicting what Prophet told us not to do ..signs that take our mind off the true purpose? many sunnis do the same by going to graves..
[quote]
Originally posted by Degas:
**hello hello,
carrying and performing a sajda to a piece of rock or clay.... **
[/quote]
IS it not the SUNNAH of MY Rasool pbuh to perform Sajda on soil. or Was it sunnah to perform sajda on the Silken Carpets.
[quote]
Originally posted by hello hello:
** IS it not the SUNNAH of MY Rasool pbuh to perform Sajda on soil. or Was it sunnah to perform sajda on the Silken Carpets.
**
[/quote]
was it Karbala soil that Prophet PBUH used for making sajda?
We oughta be Changez like, don't we?
Hello
Judging by your comments, literacy and grammar skills, one might suspect that you do not have much knowledge on Shia beliefs let alone Sunni and other World Faiths.
Instead of blindly arguing and trying to shout the loudest, give evidence beyond reasonable doubt.
Me and AISHAH, your brother in arms, very rarely agree on a lot of this sectarianism stuff, but we produce supporting evidence in order to confirm our views. Even though I believe he is wrong, I would still ask you to take a leaf out of his book and try to present your arguments in a similar manner.
In the meantime, can you please confirm what the Qur'aan states about Hazrat Ali?
Also, please confirm the lineage of Imaam Jafar Sadiq?
Why did Hazrat Ali name three of his sons after the 3 caliphs that you despise? Just for the record, here is the proof:
‘Ali ibn Abi Talib himself names three of his sons Abu Bakr, ‘Umar and ‘Uthman. (See al-Shaykh al-Mufid, Kitab al-Irshad, pp. 268-269, where these three sons of ‘Ali are listed as numbers 12, 6 and 10 respectively.)
And finally, why did Hazrat Ali give his daughter in marriage to Hazrat Umar.
Before you dismiss, the marriage issue, I urge you investigate the following statement:
‘Ali ibn Ibrahim—from his father—from Ibn Abi ‘Umayr—from Hisham ibn Salim and Hammad—from Zurarah, who narrates that
—Imam Ja‘far as-Sadiq said regarding the marriage of Umm Kulthum: "That was a ‘woman’ who was taken from us by force." (Furu‘ al-Kafi, vol. 5 p. 347, Dar al-Adwa
Humayd ibn Ziyad—Ibn Sama‘ah—Muhammad ibn Ziyad—‘Abdullah ibn Sinan—Mu‘awiyah ibn ‘Ammar—Imam Ja‘far as-Sadiq:
—[Mu‘awiyah ibn ‘Ammar says:] I asked him about a woman whose husband died: Should she spend her ‘iddah in her house, or where she wants to? He replied, "Where she wants to. When ‘Umar died, ‘Ali u came and took Umm Kulthum to his house." (Furu‘ al-Kafi, vol. 6 p. 117, Dar al-Adwa
If you want to challenge the authenticity of the narrators, then please be my guest, as you will yet again disrespect the Imaam!
I suggest you call AISHAH to the rescue!!!
[quote]
Originally posted by Zein:
**Its soooo sad to C that Shias always tend to ruin such nice threads. There is just no doubt about the class of Hazrat Abu Baker and Umer (RzTA).
I myself have personally looked into Shias for the past 14 years. And there are just so many things ur 12 so called miserable miscreants Imams have made up. Let me tell u a bit about ur religion if u be-long to it. There are twenty-two groups who censure the Ashâb-i-kirâm. The worst of these groups are the heretics who say that “Allah exists in Alî. To worship Alî means to worship Him.” The second worst group, on the other hand, castigate the first group, saying, “How could Alî ever be Allah? He is human. Yet he is the highest member of mankind. Allah sent the Qur’ân al-kerîm to him. But Jebrâîl (the arch-angel) favoured Muhammad ‘alaihis-salâm’ and brought the Qur’ân al-kerîm to him, depriving Alî of his right.” There is yet a third group, who reprove them, saying, “What a nonsense to say! Our Prophet is Muhammad ‘alaihis-salâm’. Only, he had said that Alî should be Khalîfa after him.
Zein **
[/quote]
It's sad is it ?
[quote]
Originally posted by sholay:
**
**
[/quote]
Judging by your comments, literacy and grammar skills, one might suspect that you do not have much knowledge on Shia beliefs<<<
I have never claimed that I have lots of knowledge about mine or your religon. and what does it have to do with my grammitical mistakes.
give evidence beyond reasonable doubt<<<
Ask me for the evidence and I will provide it inshaAllah. I assumed that you already know about your religon and whatever is in your books. I write mostly reading from your books.
In the meantime, can you please confirm what the Qur'aan states about Hazrat Ali?<<<<
Quran called Hazrat Ali as the wali. he is the only one in history we find who gave zakat while in rakku.
Quaran called hazrat Ali a.s as Nufs e Rasool pbuh in ayat e mubahila.
Quran called Hazrat Ali(a.s) as clean from all the sins in ayat e tutheer.
List can go on and on....
Why did Hazrat Ali name three of his sons after the 3 caliphs that you despise?<<
I am not going to argue weather Hazrat Ali a.s had three sons after the names of 3 caliph or not. I will however ask you that why do you think we still have people with the names of aas , utba, aqba of Jung e Badar, umroo of Khandaq, khalid of Uhad, umar of guzwa bani nazeer. These people killed many Ashab e Rasool pbuh.
Dear Shias
I have just seen your answer to me regarding two grate personalities in Islam.
It seems to me you never been to Islamic School, I mean you have not studied Hadees .Lets make first thing decide ,do we believe that every thing in quran is the real word of god(Allah) . You can reply later on for the time being I am saying yes . If you get Quran now it would help you to make the concepts clear. Allah says in Quran whatever Rasoolah is saying is not his word but the word of Allah , and none of us would say Allah can be worng sometimes ,would you say? I hope you gona say No , but thing is this the wording of Quran? Allah says in Quran " Oh Believers the wifes of the Prophet are the mothers of Muslims ,you can not get marry with them ,Allah has made you to take them into your Nikah " If you have studied history then you must know how many wifes Rasoolah had ,I tell you he had 11 .First one Hazrat Kadija-tul-Kubrah . If I ask you would you tell me the names of your family, you will not put the names of your wife under that family list ,of course you will ,that mean wifes is not out of family , and oviusely you will add up the closest people as well for example your daughter,their husbands , your wife dad and mum ,etc.I do know why people always forget that Hazrat Abubaker and Hazrat Umar are Father in Law of Rasoolah ,and Hazrat usman is son of Law ,that mean they all belonng to family of Rasoolah(Aleh Bat) , second thing would you ming to go to your Mulana and find out ,who had lead the funarel prayer of Hazrat Fatimah ,they will say Abubaker ,ask them where was Hazrat Ali on that time ,they gona say he was prayering behind him ,here your answer of all questions ,how come Hazrat Ali such a big personality would allow to lead the Namae Janazah (funarel Prayer ) to a munafiq,no way ,but he did say him to do so .
One thing I want to ask you was Hazrat Ali weak or munafiq(may Allah forgive my word ) he did not stop to Hazrat Abubaker and Hazrat Umar to do all non Islamic things after Rasoolah and he even did not raise his voice for Haq against KUfer ,why he let them do ,what ever they did ewant to do ,as you know his sons would not allow to Yazeed to do what ever he did want to do in his time against Islam , my friend their are lots of facts , according to your books you would say he addopted Takia (that mean he compomised with the time) but if you study Quran you would find the Companians of Musa ALhay Salam spoke bake to Feroon ,the did not compromise with the time ,they were students of Musa Ale Salam but Hazrat Ali was close student of Rasoolah and he sat down and did prefer compromise against Kufer ,I am sure you would say he was not compromiser , that mean he never had any problem with Hazrat Umar and Abubaker .
Now lets talk about Hadees , Rasoolah has said my all Sahabah are like stars ,whomesoever follow them will get in paradise " and Abubaker will be the first man after me who would go in paradise after me,there eight gates of Paradise and he will be called out from all gates to get in paradise , and Rasoolah has said in his life the comes under my grave is part of paradise and Hazrat Umer and Abubaker are sleeping in Paradise with Rasoolah .
I would give you lots of proof that a person who does not belive in these persons he is not even muslim according to Quran and Hadees.
I will write you more ,wait for it ,I have got to go now
See you soon
Zein
[This message has been edited by Zein (edited August 30, 2001).]
Why discuss so long.....it was fate and fate is in Allahs hand. Do you all agree on this??! Then why challenge ALLAH(swt)?!
Then why blame shias or sunnis or anyone else!!`??
"kaisay na karta usko main pyar, uski haseen main sukh thay hazaar, bichar gayay hum dukh ki hay baat"
[This message has been edited by Ali_R (edited August 30, 2001).]
Salam to All Muslims
A hadîth foretells that Muslims will fragment into seventy-three groups. Each of these seventy-three groups claims to obey the Sharî’at. Each group says that it is the one that will be saved from Hell. It is declared in the fifty-third âyat of Mu’minûn Sûra and in the thirty-second âyat of Rûm Sûra: “... Each party rejoices in that which is with itself.” However, among these various groups, the sign, the symptom of the one that will be saved is given by our Prophet ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’ as follows: “Those who are in this group are those who follow the way which I and my Sahâba follow.” After mentioning himself, the owner of the Sharî’at did not need to mention the Sahâba ‘ridwânullâhi ta’âlâ ’alaihim ajma’în’; yet his mentioning them may come to mean: “My way is the way which my Sahâba follow. The way to salvation is the only way which my Sahâba follow.” As a matter of fact, it is declared in the eightieth âyat of Nisâ Sûra: “He who obeys my Messenger has certainly obeyed Allâhu ta’âlâ.” To disobey the Messenger is to disobey Allâhu ta’âlâ. Disobeying him is disobeying Allâhu ta’âlâ. Declaring: “They want to differentiate between the way of Allâhu ta’âlâ and the way of His Messenger. They say, ‘We believe some of what you say but we do not believe others.’ They want to open a different way between the two. Certainly they are disbelievers,” about those who presume that obeying Allâhu ta’âlâ is different from obeying His Messenger, in the hundred and fiftieth âyat of Nisâ Sûra, He informs us that they are disbelievers. He who says that he follows the Prophet ‘alaihissalâtu wassalâm’ though he does not follow the way of the Sahâba ‘ridwânullahi ta’âlâ ’alaihim ajma’în’ is wrong. He has not followed him ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’; he has disobeyed him. He who has taken such a way will not be saved in the Hereafter. In the eighteenth âyat of Mujâdala Sûra, “They think they are doing something right. Be it known that they are liars, disbelievers,” He shows how such people are.
Those who follow the way of the Sahâba ‘alaihimurridwân’ are no doubt the group of the Ahl as-Sunnat wa-l-jamâ’at. May Allâhu ta’âlâ give plenty of rewards to the superiors of this group, who worked incessantly without falling tired! The group that will be saved from Hell is only this one. For, he who speaks ill of our Prophet’s ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’ Sahâba ‘alaihimurridwân’ is certainly deprived of following them. Such is the case for the sect of Shiite and the group of Khârijî.
[There are twelve groups of Shiites. Each group has parted into sub-groups. Some of them lead a life without an ablution, without a ghusl. Few of them perform namâz. They all hold non-Sunnî beliefs. They are not Alawîs. Alawî means a person who loves and follows the Ahl-i Bayt. Imâm-i Alî and his children from Hadrat Fâtima are called the Ahl-i Bayt. The honour of loving the Ahl-i Bayt has fallen to the lot of the Ahl as-Sunnat, who have said that loving and following them will cause one to die with îmân. Then, the real Alawîs are the Ahl as-Sunnat, not the Shi’îs. Therefore, a person who wants to be an Alawî has to be Sunnî. Today, zindîqs, and people who have no relationship with Islam appropriate the name of Alawî, plagiarizing it from the Ahl as-Sunnat. Under the shade of this beautiful name, they try to mislead the youth from Rasûlullah’s way. Our book entitled Documents of the Right Word provides detailed information on this subject.]
The Mu’tazila group appeared later. Wâsil bin Atâ, its founder, used to be a disciple of Hadrat Hasan-i Basrî ‘rahmatullâhi ’aleyh’; because he dissented from Hasan-i Basrî’s way by saying that there was a third mode between îmân and kufr, Hasan-i Basrî said, “I’tazala annâ,” about him, which means, “He has dissented from us.” All the other groups appeared later.
To slander the Sahâba means to slander Allâhu ta’âlâ’s Prophet ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’. As declared: “He who disrespects the Sahâba does not have îmân in Allâhu ta’âlâ’s Messenger.” Indeed, to slander them means to slander their owner, their master ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’. May Allâhu ta’âlâ protect us against lapsing into such a dirty creed. It is the Sahâba who conveyed to us the Sharî’at, which originated from the Qur’ân and from hadîths. When they are slandered, the thing which they conveyed too loses its value. The Sharî’at was not conveyed to us by a few certain persons among the Sahâba. Each of them has a service, a share in the blessed work. They are all equal in trueness, in justice and in (the authenticity of) their teaching. When any one of the Sahâba ‘alaihimurridwân’ is slandered, the Islamic dîn has been slandered and cursed. May Allâhu ta’âlâ protect us all from lapsing into such a loathsome situation!
If those who vituperate against the Sahâba say, “We still follow the Sahâba. It is not necessary to follow them all. In fact, it is not possible, for their words do not agree with each other. Their ways are different,” We will answer them as follows:
Following some of the Sahâba requires not denying any of them. When some of them are disliked, the others have not been followed. Amîr [Alî ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anh’], for instance, respected the other three Khalîfas, deemed them great and knew that they were worth obeying. He obeyed them willingly and accepted them as Khalîfas. Unless the other three Khalîfas are loved, it will be a lie, a slander to say that one follows Hadrat Alî ‘radiy-Allâhu ta’âlâ ’anhum’. In fact, it will mean to dislike Hadrat Alî and to refute his words. It would be a stupid and ignorant word to say about Hadrat Alî ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anh’, who is Allâhu ta’âlâ’s Lion, that he handled them and that he only smiled at them. What wisdom could admit that Allah’s Lion, despite his great knowledge and bravery, concealed his enmity against the three Khalîfas, pretended to be friends with them and established a superficial friendship with them for a full period of thirty years. Even the lowest Muslim could not stomach such hypocrisy. We should recognize the ugliness of such words which belittle Hadrat Amîr to such an extent and which misrepresent him as impotent, deceitful and hypocritical. Even if we could suppose for a moment that Hadrat Amîr ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anh’ was so —may Allah protect us from such a supposition— what would they say about the fact that our Master the Prophet ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’ praised these three Khalîfas, lauded them and esteemed them throughout his life? Would they say that our Prophet ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’ was hypocritical, too? Never! It is impossible. It is wâjib for the Prophet ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’ to tell the truth. He who says that he was deceiving them becomes a zindiq and becomes irreligious. Allâhu ta’âlâ declares in the sixty-seventh âyat of Mâida Sûra: “O My dear Messenger! Proclaim what was sent down to you from your Allah! If you do not communicate this message correctly, you will not have done your duty as a Prophet! Allâhu ta’âlâ will protect you against those who mean enmity towards you.” The disbelievers had been saying that Hadrat Muhammad ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’ had been communicating whatever suited his purpose and not communicating whatever did not suit his purpose of the Qur’ân that had been revealed to him. Upon that, this âyat was revealed to declare that he had been telling the truth. Our Prophet ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’ praised the three Khalîfas and held them above all others until he honoured the Hereafter with his presence. This means to say that it cannot be erroneous or wrong to praise them or to hold them superior.
It is necessary to follow all of the Sahâba in the tenets to be believed, for there is no difference among them in the facts to be believed. There may be a difference in the furû’, that is, in practices.
A person who speaks ill of one of the Sahâba ‘ridwânullâhi ta’âlâ ’alaihim ajma’în’ has blemished all of them. For, the îmân, the belief held by all of them was the same. He who slanders one of them has followed none of them. He has said that they disagreed with one another and that there was no unity among them. To slander one of them means to deny what he said. Let us say once more that all the Sahâba communicated the Sharî’at. Each of them was just and right. There is something in the Sharî’at conveyed by each and every one of them. The Qur’ân al-kerîm is a collection of âyats; and each and every one of the Sahâba conveyed to us at least one or two of those âyats. He who dislikes some of them will have disliked the one who communicated the Sharî’at. As is seen, that person will have acted in contradiction with all of the Sharî’at. Can such a person be saved from Hell? Allâhu ta’âlâ declares in the eighty-fifth âyat of Baqara Sûra: “Do you believe some of the Qur’ân and disbelieve some of it! The punishment of those who do so will be abasement and humiliation in the world. And in the Hereafter they will be hurled down into the most vehement torment.”
The Qur’ân was collected by Hadrat ’Uthmân ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anh’. In fact, it was collected by Abû Bakr-i Siddîq and ’Umar Fârûq ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anhumâ’. The Qur’ân that was collected by Hadrat Amîr was other than this one. As it can be understood, to slander these great people means in effect to slander the Qur’ân. May Allâhu ta’âlâ protect all Muslims from lapsing into such a disastrous situation! One of the mujtahids of the Shiite sect was asked, “The Qur’ân was collected by Hadrat ’Uthmân ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anh’. What would you say about the Qur’ân collected by him?” He answered, “I do not see any use in finding fault with the Qur’ân, for slandering the Qur’ân causes the dîn to be demolished.”
Certainly, a wise person cannot say that all the Sahâba ‘radiy-Allâhu ta’âlâ ’alaihim ajma’în’ agreed on a wrong decision on the day when our Master the Prophet ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’ died. In fact, on that day thirty-three thousand of the Sahâba unanimously made Hadrat Abû Bakr-i Siddîq ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anhum’ Khalîfa willingly. It is impossible for thirty-three thousand Sahâbîs to agree on a mistake. As a matter of fact, our Prophet ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’ had declared: “My Ummat never agrees on a wrong decision.” The reason why Hadrat Amîr was first sorry was because he was not called to those talks. He himself acknowledged that this was so and said, “I was sorry because I was called to the talks late. But I know well that Abû Bakr ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anh’ is superior to us all.” There was a reason why he was called late. That is, he was then among the Ahl-i Bayt; he was busy consoling them.
The disagreements among the Sahâbîs ‘radiy-Allâhu ta’âlâ ’alaihim ajma’în’ of our Prophet ‘sall-Allâhu ’alaihi wa sallam’ were not because of the desires of the nafs or for evil thoughts, for their blessed nafses had been purged and become quite pure. They had gotten rid of being ammâra and attained itmînan (to believe and understand the truth). Their only desire was to obey the Sharî’at. Their disagreements were based on a difference of ijtihâd. Their intention was to find what was right. Allâhu ta’âlâ will give one grade of thawâb to those who erred, too. There are at least two grades of thawâb for those who were right. We should not hurt any of those great people with our tongues! We should mention each of them with good terms. Hadrat Imâm-i Shâfi’î ‘rahmatullâhi ’aleyh’, who was one of the greatest savants of the Ahl as-sunnat, said, “Allâhu ta’âlâ did not smear our hands with their blood. So let us not smear our tongues!” Again, he said, “After Rasûlullah, the Sahâba pondered very much. Finding no one on earth superior to Abû Bakr-i Siddîq, they designated him as Khalîfa. They accepted to serve under him.” This statement of Imâm-i Shâfi’î also shows that Hadrat Alî was never hypocritical and that he willingly accepted Abû Bakr-i Siddîq as Khalîfa.
Mayân Shaikh Abulkhayr’s son, Mayân Sayyid, is a descendant of great and noble people. Also, he was in your service in the Dakkan expedition. It is hoped that he will be blessed with your help and kind treatment. Mawlânâ Muhammad ’Ârif is also a student of knowledge and a descendant of the great. His father is dead. He was a khodja. He came to you in order to receive his stipend. It is hoped that Your Highness will help him. Wassalâm wa-l-ikrâm!
Islamic scholars have written very many books in order to prove that the Shiites have deviated from the right path and that especially the most unbridled and the most excessive of them have altogether dissented from Islam and have been striving to demolish Islam. The titles of some of them together with their authors have been given below. On behalf of religious brotherhood and humanity, I pray to Allâhu ta’âlâ that our brothers in Islam who say that they are Alawîs will read these books carefully and will observe the difference between the Ahl as-Sunnat and these people and choose the right way by using their wisdom, conscience and reason and not believe the lies and slanders of the ignorant separatists. Thereby they will attain happiness in this world and in the Hereafter by holding fast to the way of safety and salvation.
**Allâhumma salli ’alâ Muhammadin wa ’alâ Âlihi wa Sahbihi wa sellim.
May Allâhu ta’âlâ bless you with the fortune of walking along the path of Sharî’at-i Mustafâwiyya ‘alâ sâhibissalâtu wassalâm’!
Zein
**
Ok forget to stick in the books
Of the books written by Islamic savants in order to advise the Shiites, here are a few:
1— The book Ibtâl-ul-Manhaj-il bâtil was written by Fadl bin Ruzbahân. It refutes the book Minhâj-ul-karâma by Ibn-ul-Mutahhir, one of the Shiite savants, and rebuts its falsifications by means of documents. He wrote the book in Isfahan in 852 [1448 A.D.]
2— The book Nuzhat-ul-ithnâ ashariyya, written by Mirzâ Ahmad bin Abdurrahîm-i Hindî, gives information about Shiites. He passed away in 1255 [A.D. 1839].
3— The book Nawâqid was written by Mirzâ Mahdûm. The book An-nawâqid lil-Rawâfid was written by Sayyid Muhammad bin Abdurrasûl Barzanjî, who was drowned in the sea in 1103 [1711 A.D.].
4— The book Muhtasar-i Nawâqid is an abridged version of the book Nawâqid. The abridgement was made by Muhammad bin Abdurrasûl-i Barzanjî.
5— The book Sayf-ul-bâtir li-riqab-ushshî’t-i warrâfida-til-kawâfir was written by Shaikh Alî bin Ahmad Hitî in Istanbul in 1025 A.H.
6— The book Ajwiba-tul Irâqiyya Alal’as’ilatil-Îrâniyya was written by Shihâbuddîn Sayyid Mahmûd bin Abdullah Âlûsî, a Shâfi’î scholar in Baghdâd (d.1270 [1854 A.D.]
7— The book Ajwiba-tul Irâqiyya Alal’as’ilatil-Lâhûriyya was written by Âlûsî. Also, Haydarî wrote a book with the same title.
8— The book Nafahât-ul-qudsiyya fî mabâhis-il-imâmiyya fî-radd-ish-shî’a, written by Âlûsî, refutes the Shiites.
9— The book Nahj-us-salâma also was written by Shihâbuddîn Âlûsî.
10— The book Sârim-ul-hadîd was written by Muhammad Amîn bin Alî Baghdâdî. It confutes the slanders of Ibni Abil-Hadîd.
11— The book Raddu-alal-imâmiyya was written by Alî bin Muhammad Suwaydî Baghdâdî. He was in the Shâfi’î Madhhab. He passed away in Damascus in 1237 [1822 A.D.].
12— The book Hâdîqa-tus-sarâir was written by Abdullah bin Muhammad Bitûshî. He was a Shâfi’î of Baghdâd, and passed away in Basra in 1211 [1797 A.D.].
13— The book Tuhfa-i ithnâ asharîyya fî radd-ir-rawâfid was written in Persian by Shâh Abdul’âzîz-i Dahlawî. He passed away in 1239 [1824 A.D.]. Its Arabic translation was abridged by Shukrî Âlûsî and printed with the title Mukhtasar-i Tuhfa in Baghdad, and the abridged version was reproduced in Istanbul in 1976.
14— The book Minha-tul-ilâhiyya mukhtasar-i Tuhfa-i ithnâ ashariyya was written by Mahmûd Shukrî Âlûsî. It was printed in Cairo in 1373 A.H.
15— Imâm-i Rabbânî ‘rahmatullâhi ta’âlâ ’aleyh’ explains the superiorities of the Sahâba very well with documentary proofs in his book Maktûbât.
16— The book Hujaj-i qat’iyya was written in Arabic by Abdullah-i Suwaydî. It was printed together with the Arabic book An-Nâhiya an’ta’n-i-Amîr-ul-mu’minîn Mu’âwiya in Istanbul in 1981.
17— In the books Milal-Nihal by Shihristânî ‘rahmatullâhi ta’âlâ ’aleyh’ and in its Turkish, English, French and Latin versions, Shiism is explained in detail and answers are given.
18— The Turkish book Tazkiya-i Ahl-i Bayt gives beautiful answers to the Shiites. It was written by ’Uthmân Bey, who was the Shaikh of Topkapý Mevlevîhânesi, and it was printed in Istanbul in 1295 A.H. Along with Hujaj-i Qat’iyya, it was printed in the Latin alphabet within the Turkish book Hak Sözün Vesîkalarý in Istanbul.[87]
19— Hadrat Imâm-i Rabbânî’s ‘rahmatullâhi ta’âlâ ’aleyh’ book Radd-i-Rawâfid is in Persian and its Turkish version has been printed in the Latin alphabet within the book Hak Sözün Vesîkalarý in Istanbul. (Please see footnote.)
20— The great savant Ibni Hajar-i Haytamî ‘rahmatullâhi ta’âlâ ’aleyh’ proves that Shiites are wrong with âyats and hadîths in his book Savâ’iq-ul-muhriqa.
21— Ibni Hajar, again, proves very well that Hadrat Mu’âviyya ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anh’ cannot be spoken ill of in his book Tathîr-ul-janân wallisân an Mu’âwiyya-tabni-Abî Sufyân.
22— Ibni Taymiyya, in his book Minhâjus-sunna-tinnabawiyya fî naqdi kalâm-ish-shî’as wa-l-qadariyya, refutes the book Minhâj-ul-karâma by Ibnil-Mutahhîr, one of the Shiite savants, with sound documents.
23— Ibni Taymiyya, again, explains the superiorities of the Sahâba, with sound documents in his book Fadâil-i Abû Bakr wa ’Umar.
24— In the translation of Mavâhib-i ladunniyya and in Mir’ât-i kâinât the glory of the Sahâba is explained.
25— The Turkish pamphlet captioned Sahâba-t-al kirâm by Sayyid Abdulhakîm-i Arwâsî ‘rahmatullâhi ta’âlâ ’aleyh’ was printed in Istanbul.[88]
26— The book Nûr-ul-Hudâ, written by Karakashzâda ’Umar bin Muhammad Bursawî Halwatî in 1005 A.H. [1597 A.D.], confutes the Shiites and Baktâshîs. It was printed in Istanbul in 1286 A.H. He passed away in Edirne in 1047 [1638 A.D.].
27— Manâqib-i Chihâr yâr-i ghuzîn, which is in Turkish, explains the superiorities of the Sahâba ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anhum ajma’în’ very well. It was written by Sayyid Ayyûb bin Siddîq Urmawî. It was reprinted various times. The edition of 1264 A.H. is so beautiful.
28— Shiism is explained and the advice which Islamic savants gave to them are explained in full length in the Turkish books Ashâb-i kirâm, Hak Yolun Vesîkalarý, Herkese Lâzým Olan Îmân, and Fâideli Bilgiler, which have been edited various times in Istanbul. [Of these three books, the second one, Hak Sözün Vesîkalarý, was rendered into English in 1992. The English version, entitled Documents of the Right Word, consists of 480 pages and is vastly informative and competently corroborative.]
29— It is written in the books Berîqa and Hadîqa that those who believe in transmigration and those who hold the belief that Allah entered a certain person’s body are disbelievers.
30— Yûsuf Nabhânî, in the final part of his book Shawâhid-ul-haqq, gives very beautiful responses with documents to the Shiites.
31— Sayyid Ahmad Dahlân ‘rahmatullâhi ’aleyh’ vehemently refutes the Shiites in his book Al-fat-hul-mubîn. This book of his was printed as a complementary at the end of Hujaj-i qat’iyya by Suwaydî. (Please see item 18.)
32— Shah Waliyullah-i Dahlawî ‘rahmatullâhi ’aleyh’ refutes the Shiites with strong documents and praises Hadrat Mu’âwiyya very highly in his book Izâlat-ul-hafâ an khilâfat-ul-khulafâ. The book, in Persian, was printed in Pakistan in 1392 [1972 A.D.] together with its Urdu translation. It consists of two volumes.]
Zein
[This message has been edited by Zein (edited August 31, 2001).]
hello hello.......
You are beating about bushes.......
If Hadrat Ali(Radi Allah an hu) was the first one to read behind Prophet(peace be upon him).......
Then what about Hadrat Abu Bakr(Radi Allah an hu) who would lead Prophet(peace be upon him) in the prayer......
And why do you pick just half of my talk.....
We don't compare Sahabas with each other because one has shown more Keramats than others so he is great...or because one is Prophet's(peace be upon him) relative so he is better than others......
You need to grow a bit more to understand this classification
And the order among four Caliphs was undisputedly practised by Sahabas during the time of Prophet(peace be upon him)
[quote]
Originally posted by hello hello:
** >>>>>So it means those who weren't born in Kabah were less respectful....if so then what about Prophet(Peace be upon him) where was he born?>>>>>>>>>
I was comparing only three khalifas of muslims. But....
You would have never asked me this question, had you known the status of MY Rasool pbuh.
My Rasool's status is higher than anybody. MY Rasool pbuh was There when prophet Hazrat Adam a.s was being created with clay. My Rasool pbuh was There when Prophet Ibrahim a.s was raising the walls of KABA. My Rasool pbuh was the witness on all ~123999 prophets.
<<<<<
A person who was the first Muslim to pray behind My Rasool pbuh for seven years before anybody else and was raised by MY Rassol pbuh since infancy is by GOD better than any of the sahabas.
We Sunnis don't put any comparison between Sahabas that who was better and who wasn't>>>>>>>
You Don't?????
Think again!!!!!
Read the very first sentence of the very first post of this thread. Zein wrote:
"The Shaikhayn, i.e. Hadrat Abû Bakr and Hadrat ’Umar ‘radiy-Allâhu ’anhumâ’, are the highest ones of the Ashâb-i-kirâm"
You Don't stop here, You people go to the next step and Say things about Rasool pbuh Ahlulbait a.s like Zein wrote above:
"And there are just so many things ur 12 so called miserable miscreants Imams have made up"**
[/quote]
Zein,
You are ignorant as you are naive.
Quoting all yr sunni sources means diddly. Granted, I am sure that some of what they say conforms to Islamic principles, and I will readily accept them.
However, the sunni concept of not criticizing any of the so called "sahabahs" ARE NOT PROVEN FROM THE QURAN.
Firstly, we need to discuss whether shias are correct in criticizing SOME of the sahabahs.
Then, we can look at specific facts related to Bakri, Farooq, and Ghani.
So, you tell me, where does it say in the Qur'an that ALL SAHABAHS WERE RIGHTEOUS and that CRITICIZING THEM IS AGAINST ISLAM.
Please post relevant posts. Granted, the qur'an does praise some sahabahs at certain events. But what I am asking for is this:
DOES THE QURAN SAY THAT SAHABAHS (COMPANIONS WHO LIVED AT THE TIME OF THE PROPHET AND WHO WERE WITH HIM) CANNOT BE CRITICIZED ?
[This message has been edited by a1shah (edited August 31, 2001).]
with the attitude you have, people would give a damn to discuss with you???
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/disgust.gif
does it give you a right to decide their destination ?
We oughta be Changez like, don’t we?
Changez,
Your disgust if of no concern to me.
In order to follow the truth, you need to recognize who's speaking the truth.
We don't care of the "destiny" of these questionable sahabahs.
Our concern is to follow the correct teachings of our holy prophet (pbuh) as taught to us by his righteous, most knowledgeable companions.
They are the ahl-bait (as), whom the qur'an calls "The people of the Reminder" and "Those firmly grounded in knowledge".