the truth!

Society Religion & Philosophy
21

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by yahudi: *
Excerpts from 6. Al-Anam
27.If you could but see when they will be held over the (Hell) Fire! They will say: "Would that we were but sent back (to the world)! Then we would not deny the Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, revelations, etc.) of our Lord, and we would be of the believers!"

  1. Nay, it has become manifest to them what they had been concealing before. But if they were returned (to the world), they would certainly revert to that which they were forbidden. And indeed they are liars.

In verse 27, Ayat is directly connected to the teachings of Islam.

This is a very small sample. It starts from verse No. 7 of 1st chapter and continues till last. You can understand why Islamic militants are so confident when they shoot someone.

Majority of verses in Quran are wasted on explaining the behavior of non-believers, no need to say that as per Quran all non-Muslims are non-believers.
I do not know what this all has to do with ‘Truth’.
[/QUOTE]

mr. yahudi.

with all due respect, to understand a scenario, you have to read it from the begining and understand it well before you start discussing it.
The Verses you have quoted here are from Surah An'aam. The purpose of this surah is to tell human beings the blasphemies of people ..who made fun of the Quraanic Verses and called them a lie.
These people joined Allah with other Gods.

Now i would like to ask everyone a question here.

Is it decent to "call other religions a lie" ?? :)
i think i know your answers..its a "NO!" ..
as many of our fellow beings here are protesting about one thing..and that is.. "disrespecting other religions!!".

So my dear friends..if you 'carefully' and with an 'open mind' read the whole Surah Anaam..you will find that its those people who "criticised, abused the word of God..called it a MAGIC".
So my friends..we have been then told about the punishment of such people.

If i start calling Christians & Jews a lie, abuse them, call their verses MAGIC..then my friends i know what will be your response.

Quraan has condemed the blasphemies and criticism of those who does not believe in Quraan and Allah. Quraan has asked Muslims to respect those who respect Islam and Allah and Muslims...even if they are non-muslims.

Whenever you try to blame or accuse someone..please do realise how strong and true your proof is, propagandas are easy to make :).

22

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by hafeez123: *
...And, Islam came and made everyone else a non-believer and hell-dwellers....

Is this the purpose of the TRUTH?

[/quote]

Dear friend..
Quraan came and showed many the right path..this is the truth.
Quraan made those 'hell-dwellers' who criticised God, and tried to harm those who follow Quraan and believe in one true God.."Allah"

[quote]

It is nothing more than a charade:
** My god is better than your god**;

All Abrahamic creeds/TRUTH -if followed literally, peaches:
Hate your fellow being if he/she is not of you.

The ONLY TRUTH is:
We are all from the same source; so, Be virtuous to all
[/QUOTE]

sigh...
Quraan always talked about one true God..and yes talked about religion.
"Lakum deenakum wali-a-deen".

Heres a lill for you guys what Quraan thinks about other religions :

109:1 Say : O ye that reject Faith!
109:2 I worship not that which ye worship,
109:3 Nor will ye worship that which I worship.
109:4 And I will not worship that which ye have been wont to worship,
109:5 Nor will ye worship that which I worship.
*109:6 To you be your Way, and to me mine. *

23

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by New Era: *

Dear friend..
Quraan came and showed many the right path..this is the truth.
Quraan made those 'hell-dwellers' who criticised God, and tried to harm those who follow Quraan and believe in one true God.."Allah"

sigh...
Quraan always talked about one true God..and yes talked about religion.
"Lakum deenakum wali-a-deen".

Heres a lill for you guys what Quraan thinks about other religions :

109:1 Say : O ye that reject Faith!
109:2 I worship not that which ye worship,
109:3 Nor will ye worship that which I worship.
109:4 And I will not worship that which ye have been wont to worship,
109:5 Nor will ye worship that which I worship.
*109:6 To you be your Way, and to me mine. *
[/QUOTE]

how do you prove god only listens to you? only helps one specefic sect
of human population?

24

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by rvikz: *

how do you prove god only listens to you? only helps one specefic sect
of human population?
[/QUOTE]

Do i need to PROVE ? :)

Just think..before Islam..before the EVER FIRST MUSLIM..
who was responsible to listen and to GUIDE the one who became the first believer among non believers ?

it was Allah. the one God.

He listens to everyone..and what was commanded to the Prophets by Allah was "your duty is to teach and preach..while my duty is to give them "Hidayat" the guidance!!".

Man is NOT responsible for giving this Hidayat..this is all from Him only.
we are only limited to TELL...rest is HIS job.

25

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by New Era: *

Do i need to PROVE ? :)

Just think..before Islam..before the EVER FIRST MUSLIM..
who was responsible to listen and to GUIDE the one who became the first believer among non believers ?

it was Allah. the one God.

He listens to everyone..and what was commanded to the Prophets by Allah was "your duty is to teach and preach..while my duty is to give them "Hidayat" the guidance!!".

Man is NOT responsible for giving this Hidayat..this is all from Him only.
we are only limited to TELL...rest is HIS job.
[/QUOTE]

you reduce god to human level as biased ,jealous and exclusive
entity.

26

are you whining ? :)

27

These two verses given above explain that people who reject the Ayats (of Islam) will be burnt in hell fire, then they will promise to follow the Ayats (of Islam) if given a chance, but they will not do so (if given a chance) because they are liars.

These verse are an open Hatred for non Muslims, what else?

70% of verses in Quran are wasted in explaining the behavior of non-believers. Is it true or falls? Why the Prophet was so conscious.
Liars, cheats, deaf and dump types of words are frequently used for people who reject Islam. This is the vocabulary standard. There is a word ‘pagana’. I am failed to understand the meaning.

Yes, Quran does not say, kill them, but I am curious to know what massage militants receive when they know that Allah curses all non-believers.

Christianity, Hinduism, Judaism or Buddhism are outcome of evolution and are related to history. These religions have accepted reforms.
Islam was imposed. Buddha or Christ never declared Prophet hood, Christ did not dictate the Bible.

I am not asking you to look for ‘Truth’ in other religions, and no need to expect it in Islam either. It is a trick to start giving explanations, excuses and definitions.

28

Christianity asks you to change the heart of your enemy with love and peace.

I am curious to know what Islam, the most peaceful religion, says on this topic

29

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by yahudi: *
**Christianity asks you to change the heart of your enemy with love and peace.*
[/quote]

As evidenced by the Crusades, i imagine?

[quote]
....I am curious to know what massage militants receive when they know that Allah curses all non-believers.
[/quote]

The same "message" that Timothy McVeigh and David Koresh thought they received from the Bible, i imagine.

30

Any edict, whether religious or not, that proscribes how a human shall think and act is false. The very thing that distingushes a human from almost all other species, is the minds - the ability to think, reason, take responsibility.

Not many other mechanisms, natural or artificial, can convert desire into reason, reason into action, action to progress.

Edicts such as those Islam or the superstitions in some practices of Hinduism - are not only merely just stupid superstitions but also downright insulting of the same God(s) they seek to glorify. Here is an instance. In the same breadth, Koran will claim allah created and managed everything. Yet it will castigate pigs as dirty and not fit for same treatment as other creations of allah. Or the wonderful 'caste' based superiority claimes by all religions under different names and pretexts.

Take the superstitions, rituals, strict rules, class systems out and then we will talk about truth through religion. Until then, religions only cloud our thinking with b.s and actually keep us from realizing the truth, the God(s) and ourselves.

31

NEW ERA,

sigh, sigh and more sighs :bummer: :bummer: :bummer:

Now,
could you show me how “Lakum deenakum wali-a-deen” is practised in the four sunni madhabs of let’s say - Pakistan, towards the other sunnis and followers of other fiqhs?

Btw - even pagans believe in the supreme spirit or the Supreme Being; the concept/belief in the One God was not discovered by Moses and taught by the Abrahamic creeds; it pre-existed Moses & all Abrahamic creeds.

As I stated previously:
My god is better than your god is nothing more than a charade and a very dangerous one at that too!

May you WAKE UP in a truly NEW ERA !

32

My dear fellows,
Please, i think this discussion is reaching a deadlock. No one can change my mind and no one can change what u believe. So accept this fact. I am a muslim and i will continue to believe what i believe.And so will all of you. So please end this discussion. It is only causing more disturbance.

33

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Nadia_H: *

As evidenced by the Crusades, i imagine?

The same "message" that Timothy McVeigh and David Koresh thought they received from the Bible, i imagine.
[/QUOTE]

Don't forget Rev. Jim Jones...

34

Mr Echo is right for backtracking. Prophet/Allah prohibits questioning the credibility of Quran verses.

And when you (Muhammad SAW) see those who engage in a false conversation about Our Verses (of the Qur'ân) by mocking at them, stay away from them till they turn to another topic. And if Shaitân (Satan) causes you to forget, then after the remembrance sit not you in the company of those people who are the Zâlimûn (polytheists and wrongdoers, etc.).

35

Where R u NEW ERA?

You couldn’t **FIND how “Lakum deenakum wali-a-deen” is practised **in the four sunni madhabs of let’s say - Pakistan, towards the other sunnis and followers of other fiqhs?

Why not just blame it on CULTURE?

36

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by hafeez123: *

Where R u NEW ERA?

You couldn't **FIND how "Lakum deenakum wali-a-deen" is practised **in the four sunni madhabs of let's say - Pakistan, towards the other sunnis and followers of other fiqhs?

Why not just blame it on CULTURE?
[/QUOTE]

How about you dearest Nadia?

How about explaining away the lack of "Lakum deenakum wali-a-deen" in most Islam DUE to Culture and not the interpretations or sharia they have chosen to follow.

Should be same as the status of women and their repression which according to you is DUE to Culture and not Religion.

37

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by hafeez123: *
**How about you dearest Nadia?

How about explaining away the lack of "Lakum deenakum wali-a-deen" in most Islam DUE to Culture and not the interpretations or sharia they have chosen to follow. Should be same as the status of women and their repression which according to you is DUE to Culture and not Religion.
[/QUOTE]
**

Sorry, i don't understand what your argument is.

What is your purpose - to explain why Quranic injunctions are not followed in Muslim countries, or to discuss the Quranic ayats themselves ? What do you wish to discuss? i am sure you realize that no faith has ever been perfectly practiced or adhered to by its followers and Islam is no exception, and neither are Christianity/Buddhism/Hinduism.

38

Ms Nadia, I protest. In total 70% verses in Quran are written against the people who reject Islam.
These verses explain that all these non-believers, indirectly non-Muslims, are cursed by Allah and they have no chance, as well as the believers, the Muslims, must never believe them because they are lairs.
Quran offers to make peace with them at your (Muslim’s) conditions, or otherwise punish them and off course they will be burnt in hell fire by Allah, as the almighty Allah is all knowing and merciful.

Now tell me why Islamic militants are so confident when they shoot non-believers?
Are not they following the massage of the Prophet and Allah?

Verily, those who disbelieve, it is the same to them whether you (O Muhammad Peace be upon him ) warn them or do not warn them, they will not believe.

Allâh has set a seal on their hearts and on their hearings, (i.e. they are closed from accepting Allâh's Guidance), and on their eyes there is a covering. Theirs will be a great torment.

39

Mr. Yahudi,

Islamic militants are not following the message of Holy Quran and Holy Prophet when they are shooting the innocent non-believers.

And its your wrong interpretation when you think that Holy Quran is 70% against the non-believers. We believe it to be a book from Allah (which is God for you) and every thing in this universe is his creation.

If you think that Holy Quran is so much against the non-believers then why it is so the Holy Prophet Nauzobillah follow its teachings. If you see the time of Holy Prophet, christians, Jews and people of other faith are not discriminated in any way during his rule in Medinah. Christians were even welcomed and allowed to pray in the prophet's mosque. At the time of conquest of Mecca, everybody's life is spared.

But the problem with you and people like you is that when you try to study Islam, you look at the people who are against non-believers but you never look at the life history of the Holy Prophet and his dealings with non-believers.

40

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by fatehahmad: *
Mr. Yahudi,

Islamic militants are not following the message of Holy Quran and Holy Prophet when they are shooting the innocent non-believers.

And its your wrong interpretation when you think that Holy Quran is 70% against the non-believers. We believe it to be a book from Allah (which is God for you) and every thing in this universe is his creation.

If you think that Holy Quran is so much against the non-believers then why it is so the Holy Prophet Nauzobillah follow its teachings. If you see the time of Holy Prophet, christians, Jews and people of other faith are not discriminated in any way during his rule in Medinah. Christians were even welcomed and allowed to pray in the prophet's mosque. At the time of conquest of Mecca, everybody's life is spared.

But the problem with you and people like you is that when you try to study Islam, you look at the people who are against non-believers but you never look at the life history of the Holy Prophet and his dealings with non-believers.
[/QUOTE]

Dear Fateh,

What is an Islamic Militant?

NOt necesarily one that belongs to al-Qaeda.

An Islamic Militant is one that follows an EXTREME teachings of Islam.

Majoritarian Islam is based on extreme & medieval interpretations. So, are they all Islamic Militants?

No. But there are those willing to put those extremist teachings into practise.

You - yourself are a militant by posting an anti-ahmedia HATE letter.

The problem is not with people like Yahudi who see examples of islam in people who practise it or the evil west.

*Time to dig deep and admit that the problem lies with us! * Time for fooling people is over. Take a hint!