Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
These people did no such thing. Their ancestors did.
People should be judged and treated because of their own actions, not something that their forefathers did centuries ago.
Mad_Scientist, kidly read the post of Pak-patriot to which I had replied. The Afghans had defeated the Marathas in their own heartland, not in Afghanistan.
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
The thread is about myths. Once a myth is shattered, people do see the reality. Do you Mr. K? I don't know when Marhatas showed up in Lahore, and when Waziris and Malakandis supplied tanks and airplanes to Lahore.
I do know that mostly Afridi pashtoons, Punjabis, and Urdu Speaking folks co-operated to defend each other against commies.
Commie threat to Pakistan and Afghanistan was real, and both Punajbis + Pashtoons + Urdu Speaking lost a lot of lives fighting against them.
Now some Pashtoons aka Waziris want to destroy all that was protected and nurtured by so much Pakistani blood.
And you want all of us to stand by and encourage these rascals. Wah Mr. K wah!
As I said earlier Mr. anti-whatever. Read some history instead of
showing your utter ignorance here. And the whole war against Soviets
were fought only by Afghans...what blood will Pakis spill for Afghanistan, pakis
cannto even fight their own war. How many had surrenderd to indians in Bengal?
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
Mad_Scientist, kidly read the post of Pak-patriot to which I had replied. The Afghans had defeated the Marathas in their own heartland, not in Afghanistan.
That's fine - I have no quarrel with those.
However, those individuals who defeated the Marathas are not the indivduals who live in Afghanistan today -- the ones who did that great deed are long dead.
We owe the Afghans of today no special favour, because the Afghans of today have done nothing for us. They were a useful tool in removing the communists from our borders 20 years ago, nothing more.
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
As I said earlier Mr. anti-whatever. Read some history instead of showing your utter ignorance here. And the whole war against Soviets were fought only by Afghans...what blood will Pakis spill for Afghanistan, pakis cannto even fight their own war. How many had surrenderd to indians in Bengal?
Dude I would have agreed with your point until you started spilling crap about Pakistan. SO SCREW YOU! Maybe you should acknowledge that when the Afgahns were fighting the war, Pakistan accepted thousands of refugees. Fighting a war doesnt always mean to get a gun and blow people up.
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
[quote="mAd_ScIeNtIsT, post:477, topic:172089"]
saheb, nobody is demanding you anything...
They were a useful tool in removing the communists from our borders 20 years ago, nothing more
very good, nothing else could be expected...
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
Maybe you should acknowledge that when the Afgahns were fighting the war, Pakistan accepted thousands of refugees. Fighting a war doesnt always mean to get a gun and blow people up.
I agree with you...
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
It's hardly as though helping Pakistan was the motivation of Afghans fighting the Soviets. They were driven by their desire to rule their own country and live their lives by their standards, not imported communist standards.
Pakistan found its own purposes could be advanced by supporting the Afghans' own purposes, so was happy to help the Afghans achieve their goals and Pakistan's own.
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran’s lies
Im not showing respect? This thread is in regards to the so called fighting capability of the tribals… Facts speak for themselves, the tribals have this myth about them, but the reality is very different from the myth. If you dont like it, to bad…
And lol.. I will remember to thank the next tribal I meet for saving me from the evil Marathas…
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
Im not showing respect? This thread is in regards to the so called fighting capability of the tribals... Facts speak for themselves, the tribals have this myth about them, but the reality is very different from the myth. If you dont like it, to bad...
and i said that these were the same tribes who saved you from Marathas rule...
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
and i said that these were the same tribes who saved you from Marathas rule...
Same tribes, but not the same people. We owe the tribesmen of today absolutely NOTHING because they did nothing in the mahratta war, they weren't even born then.
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
Same tribes, but not the same people. We owe the tribesmen of today absolutely NOTHING because they did nothing in the mahratta war, they weren't even born then.
mady :) yara did you read pak-patriots post...
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
The only advantages the Tribes men have, from my understanding are:
Living in a Mountainous area that makes it easy to fight guerilla type wars...
Their enemies are always outsider, unfamiliar with the terrain...
They have a great deal of unity under their tribal system.
** Figure out a way to negate these advantages and there goes the myth of superiority**... US proved that these people in open battle cant stand up to modern warfare as they proved in Afghanistan.
this post mad_scientist
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
and i said that these were the same tribes who saved you from Marathas rule...
And I said, I will thank the next Tribal I meet for saving me for the evil Marathas...
Anyways, we saved their brethren from the Soviets, that makes us even...
BACK TO THE POINT... The Myth of the Tribal invincibility is still just a Myth... If you cant argue against the points that I made, then you have nothing to add to this thread...
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
this post mad_scientist
So whats your point? That the myth of invicibility is NOT a myth? Bring the tribal warriors out of their mountains, pin them against an equally motivated enemy, and how well do you think they will fare?
Marathas are irrelevant... A victory here and there is meaningless, everyone has had them... Whats relevant is that just as I said, pull the tribals out of their territory and you level the field.. For example..
When many of the Pasthun tribesmen fought the Northern Alliance, their frontline was stuck in the same place for years...
Go back to the invasion of the Kashmir valley... When there was no opposition, the tribesmen were able to progress, but when confronted by the Indian Army, they were repelled...
So obviously the tribesmen arent the greatest warriors on earth and they can be confronted...
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
So whats your point? That the myth of invicibility is NOT a myth? Bring the tribal warriors out of their mountains, pin them against an equally motivated enemy, and how well do you think they will fare? Marathas are irrelevant... A victory here and there is meaningless, everyone has had them... Whats relevant is that just as I said, pull the tribals out of their territory and you level the field.. For example..
When many of the Pasthun tribesmen fought the Northern Alliance, their frontline was stuck in the same place for years...
Go back to the invasion of the Kashmir valley... When there was no opposition, the tribesmen were able to progress, but when confronted by the Indian Army, they were repelled...
So obviously the tribesmen arent the greatest warriors on earth and they can be confronted...
And 95% land that they had under their control doesn't count...
The tribes were expert in guerilla war, they had defeated the well-entrenched Dogra army and had conquered most of Kashmir but to sustain your control over conquered territory you need a regular army. Anyway, my informations regarding the ivasion of Kashmir is very limited. I'll try to dig up more information.
Re: The Myth of Afghan superiority + Imran's lies
This is one disgusting thread. I could go off and insult a large swath of Pakistanis, but that would mean sinking to their level. A few points though:
Prior to deposing Zahir Shah, Afghanistan was a relatively stable and independent nation on a development trajectory similar to Iran under the Shah, minus the natural resources.
There is no "myth" of superiority. Afghan/Pakhtun bravery has been chronicled throughout history and that trait exists till the present day. Even when outmatched by superior technology and overwhelmed by the invaders, not a day goes by without any attacks on the NATO bases/troops.
Afghan/Pakhtun culture is conservative but it is not exclusively tribal. As a ethnic group, Pakhtuns are divided into tribes but it does not mean those tribal linkages remain.
How about showing some humility when talk about Afghanistan? Sure it's a third world undeveloped country but the last time I checked Pakistan was not exactly Scandinavia.
Of course Afghanistan is under an illegitimate NATO occupation but Pakistan is indirectly under the tutelage of the US. Don't believe me? Just read the ample warnings to Musharraf on Martial Law or the US involvement in the BB-Mush accord an then talk about sovereignty. When Pakistan decides to show some guts and stand up to the US like Iran, Turkey have done, only then can it lecture other nations.
Funny how some Paks. name their missiles after Afghan/Pakhtun kings, many claim Afghan ancestry, and try to politically link up with Central Asia when it becomes convenient when their essentially seen as 'weakly persianized Indians.'
Sorry, regardless of the good and the bad, I do not forsake my identity as a Pakhtun Muslim.