Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Much about GK is exaggerated. Think about it, the man's history was more or less written by his enemies. Aside from "The Secret History of the Mongols." He wasn't as bad as people say.
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Evil or good.. his enemies truly deserved him :D
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
lol.
It's said the reason he invaded into the Iran was because the Sultan of Khwarezmia killed the party of messengers GK sent to him.
Also, apparently when he came into Europe, he saw how much it sucked in comparison to China and the Persian empire, and he just left hahaha
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Killing of messenger is considered as one of the biggest offenses in almost all the cultures. Thats why we got this phrase 'shooting the messenger'.
Khwarezem Shah is portrayed as hero in popular history, but they had their shortcomings and Khwarzam Sah shown same brutality to people of Sindh while he was being chased by Mongols. The famous city in our folklore 'Bhanbhor' was also put on fire by him and thats how this city which is considered by some historians as Deebal destroyed.
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Yeah, I'm actually reading "Genghis Khan and the Making of the Modern World" by Jack Weatherford right now. It touches on the grave issue in the opening.
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Do share something interesting from the book... soft copy?
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Alas it's a hard copy =( The guy who wrote is in anthropologist and actually worked on the secret history when it was finally declassified/opened up..
I'll share a bit from the intro though.
"Despite the many images and pictures of Genghis Khan made in subsequent years, we have no portrait of him made within his lifetime. Unlike any other conqueror in history, Genghis Khan never allowed anyone to paint his portrait, sculpt his image, or engrave his name or likeness on a coin and the only descriptions of him from contemporaries are more intriguing than informative. In the words of a modern Mognolian song about Genghis Khan, "we have imagined your appearance but our minds were blank'" (xxiv).
"In the absence of reliable information, they projected their own fears and phobias onto these accounts. With the passage of centuries, scholars weighed the atrocities and aggression committed by men such as Alexander, Caesar, Charlemagne, or Napoleon against their accomplishments or their special mission in history. For Genghis Khan and the Mongols, however, their achievements lay forgotten, while their alleged crimes and brutality became magnified" (xxv-xxvi).
Apparently, usually, mongol women also married somewhat younger men ;)
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Helen of troys grave 
Lol jk that’s a legend maybe
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Much about GK is exaggerated. Think about it, the man's history was more or less written by his enemies. Aside from "The Secret History of the Mongols." He wasn't as bad as people say.
If all the history written about him say he was bad then how can one say "he wasn't as bad as people say"?
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Evil or good.. his enemies truly deserved him :D
Well, his enemies were mostly Muslim citizens. I want to understand why they deserved to be massacred and raped on streets.
It is sad to see your selection of emoticon.
It is conflicting when one say that 1 out 200 people have his genes, and then claim that he was not as bad as historians have made him to be.
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Alas it's a hard copy =( The guy who wrote is in anthropologist and actually worked on the secret history when it was finally declassified/opened up..
I'll share a bit from the intro though. "Despite the many images and pictures of Genghis Khan made in subsequent years, we have no portrait of him made within his lifetime. Unlike any other conqueror in history, Genghis Khan never allowed anyone to paint his portrait, sculpt his image, or engrave his name or likeness on a coin and the only descriptions of him from contemporaries are more intriguing than informative. In the words of a modern Mognolian song about Genghis Khan, "we have imagined your appearance but our minds were blank'" (xxiv).
"In the absence of reliable information, they projected their own fears and phobias onto these accounts. With the passage of centuries, scholars weighed the atrocities and aggression committed by men such as Alexander, Caesar, Charlemagne, or Napoleon against their accomplishments or their special mission in history. For Genghis Khan and the Mongols, however, their achievements lay forgotten, while their alleged crimes and brutality became magnified" (xxv-xxvi).
Apparently, usually, mongol women also married somewhat younger men ;)
Cougar?
I think he was deeply in love with his first wife who got abducted, thats why he accepted her son or may be it was not taboo in Mongol society
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Well, his enemies were mostly Muslim citizens. I want to understand why they deserved to be massacred and raped on streets. It is sad to see your selection of emoticon.
It is conflicting when one say that 1 out 200 people have his genes, and then claim that he was not as bad as historians have made him to be.
His target was not a religion and Muslim population suffered all this wrath due to wrong policies of their rulers. Thats what I wanted to say. Otherwise, killing of single person can't be justified during any period
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
His target was not a religion and Muslim population suffered all this wrath due to wrong policies of their rulers.
Rulers with wrong policies were already knocked out along with their soldiers. But if then the conqueror goes ahead massacring a population, raping of women and children on streets, burning of the whole cities, etc.; then the rulers wrong policies are not to blamed as much as the cruelty of the conqueror. Genghis Khan did all this to Bukhara and Samarqand.
Yes, his target was not Islam itself. But it does not matter because it was Muslims who bore the brunt of Mongol butchery
Genghis Khan is shown in much positive light among Europeans because they did not have to go through the Mongol savagery. Another reason is that Mongols brought end to the brightest era of Islamic history, after which Muslims gave up on what made them the leading source of science and technology.
Europeans talk about the terrible things Bonaparte, or Hitler did. They accept verbatim what Herodatus said about "mythical" Greek battles, but they call "exaggeration" when several Muslim historians tell the tales of Mongol savagery inflicted on the Muslim world.
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
I agree with what you are referring to about western historians, but not only Muslim rulers were responsible for destruction of cities like Bukhara, Balakh and Samarqand, but also people including scholars played major role in weakening Muslim rule. Sectarian conflicts and debates were norm of days, when Mongols were at doors of Baghdad.
If all the history written about him say he was bad then how can one say "he wasn't as bad as people say"?
I never said he was or wasn't bad. All I said was he wasn't as bad as people say. GK brought a great number of positives too which are rarely looked at when comparing or bringing up his minuses
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
Rulers with wrong policies were already knocked out along with their soldiers. But if then the conqueror goes ahead massacring a population, raping of women and children on streets, burning of the whole cities, etc.; then the rulers wrong policies are not to blamed as much as the cruelty of the conqueror. Genghis Khan did all this to Bukhara and Samarqand.
Yes, his target was not Islam itself. But it does not matter because it was Muslims who bore the brunt of Mongol butchery
Genghis Khan is shown in much positive light among Europeans because they did not have to go through the Mongol savagery. Another reason is that Mongols brought end to the brightest era of Islamic history, after which Muslims gave up on what made them the leading source of science and technology.
Europeans talk about the terrible things Bonaparte, or Hitler did. They accept verbatim what Herodatus said about "mythical" Greek battles, but they call "exaggeration" when several Muslim historians tell the tales of Mongol savagery inflicted on the Muslim world.
In early Europe, GK was even praised. In later (~Voltaire) he was considered a terribly evil person.
And that's continued even into more contemporary times. Look at the word Mongoloid, for instance.
Re: The lost grave of Genghiz Khan
I never said he was or wasn't bad. All I said was he wasn't as bad as people say. GK brought a great number of positives too which are rarely looked at when comparing or bringing up his minuses
Everyone brings some positives. Even Hitler did. I bet even Abu Jahl must have had some very positive traits.