Burqa, One more time, How old are you?
His posts are getting childish every day. Reminds one of Benjamin Button.
This is the same exact statement made by so-called Mohajirs.
**Only people who can claim real neglect by the state are Balochis.
Rest of the ethnicities ARE THE STATE. Discrimination against Pakhtuns is a slogan mostly made popular by the socialists and pro-communists who were aligned with now-defunct afghan communists. ** .
You are confusing integration and discrimination..and changing direction on your own thread. the former is a typical mistake..the Baloch are both not integrated and discriminated against. In terms of human Development indicators after the Baloch it's the pashtun areas followed by sindhi and seraiki areas which are the poorest in the country. If you think there is no discrimination done by the Pakistani establishment you are obviously someone who believes in that kind of propaganda.
As far as the latter is concerned your basic facts are flawed as I stated in my first post.
Re: Sooba Sarhad was part of Sooba Punjab until 1902 - A bit of history
awwwwwww
burqa don't you feel left out, did we not make karachi part of "punjabistan" ??
There is a lot of truth in this to an extent although one had to discuss what type of racism.
Racism and pakistan is a very complex subject. Pakhtuns are a butt of the stupid Pathan jokes which are quite evident in the mainstream media.
Although when you look at them in terms of jobs then there appears to be no discrimination. There is no shortage of Pakhtun politicians, bureaucrats, army officers, civil servants and other government workers and this coupled with the number of large and small business owners you see in most of Pakistan including Sindh and Punjab. Pakhtuns have done well if you comapre their literacy rates with Punjabis, Sindhis and Urdu speakers.
Thanks. Yes Pakhtuns have done really well for sure. Anyone talking about discrimination against Pakhtuns must be living in either la la land, or Altaf Hussain's madeup world.
why because Pakhtuns (just like Punjabis and Urdu speaking) are the government. As you correctly said that army and bureucracy has a very large share of hard working Pakhtuns. It is only the new generation of socialists who want to raise the crap of discrimination.
Butt of jokes? Every ethnicity has their share of jokes. Is that one would call discrimination? Certainly not.
Probably the fewest jokes are about Balochis. May be no having jokes is the sign of the real discrimination.
Moreover Pakhtuns like any other ethnicity are not a monolithic group. For example Pakhtuns from charsadha are the best and brightest when it comes to education. While some tribal agencies are at the bottom of the heap.
Badshah Khan was a great leader and there is no question of disrespecting him in any way. Wish his son had not slept with socialists and communists that's all.
In any case Wali Khan played his role and now he has left the world (May Allah bless his soul).
This thread is much more about the modern day people. That we must know what we have in common vs. what we want to do to create differences.
Re: Sooba Sarhad was part of Sooba Punjab until 1902 - A bit of history
burpabox ! i think u r some what related to NWFP.
Ya its true, but same was case wid sindh which was part of bombay upto 1935.the reason 4 not thinking over naming by us bfore 1947 is that we were busy in getting rid of british in a way separate frm desis. due to our natural ties wid afghanistan, we r always deal wid caution nd suspiction by rest of pakistanis.
mr. bpox u r trying to prove tht NWFP is part of subcontinent, but u r wrong...
Re: Sooba Sarhad was part of Sooba Punjab until 1902 - A bit of history
actually NWFP was so small that it didnt deserve to b separate province of india in 1902. after having provincial status, total provinces bcom 11. why it was separated frm punjab despite too small compared to rest of 10 gaint provinces? the answer is tht we were distinguishd frm punjabis in 180 degrees.
Re: Sooba Sarhad was part of Sooba Punjab until 1902 - A bit of history
yeah!!
bring pride to pashtoons!!
.......the reason 4 not thinking over naming by us bfore 1947 is that we were busy in getting rid of british in a way separate frm desis. ....
It is a fact that back in the 40s, the only active insurgency was in FATA and in one agency namely Wazirastan. Even there Afridis and other Pashtuns were fighting AS PART of British-Indian army.
.... bpox u r trying to prove tht NWFP is part of subcontinent, but u r wrong...
May be. But the fact is that the greatest leader of NWFP aka Badshah Khan wanted Frontier to be part of subcontinent. Why else would he eat, drink, and sleep (in the same house) with Gandhi? Why Badshah Khan didn't start a movement in Afghanistan back when the Frontier was under British control?
We all are raised with fairy tales but then one day everyone of us has to grow up, and learn the facts.
Re: Sooba Sarhad was part of Sooba Punjab until 1902 - A bit of history
bacha khan did not want to join with india. his was of opinion that in refrendum choice shud b between pakistan and afghanistan. when british denied he called for bycott.
i believe if choice was given bw pakistan and afghanistan
in 1947, then NWFP would hav joined afghanistan.
It is a fact that back in the 40s, the only active insurgency was in FATA and in one agency namely Wazirastan. Even there Afridis and other Pashtuns were fighting AS PART of British-Indian army.
Aren't you missing the obvious? The settled areas of NWFP had adopted non-violence as the principle means of opposing the British. The Frontier had experienced mass arrests after the quit India movement and i believe Ghaffar was in jail for a major part of the time. Again the NWFP had the highest proportion of British Indian Army soldiers per person then anywhere in the subcontinent. It was mandatory for all British soldiers to serve one stint in the frontier..and that wasn't for a holiday. I agree though British recruitment of Pashtuns had increased in the 1940's.
May be. But the fact is that the greatest leader of NWFP aka Badshah Khan wanted Frontier to be part of subcontinent. Why else would he eat, drink, and sleep (in the same house) with Gandhi? Why Badshah Khan didn't start a movement in Afghanistan back when the Frontier was under British control?
As I mentioned prevously Ghaffar Khan first approached the old Muslim League he was dismissed as a unitelligent pathan and the various leaguers of that time were pro British unlike the Congress. The congress took a stand on improving conditions in the frontier..and in turn the people of NWFP elected his supporters to power in two elections.
Even then pakhtuns are noton par with Punjabis and Urdu speaking people. Pakhtun involvement in government affairs has icreased over the last 30 years.
You forget one major point which distorts the Punjab stats. Most of Punjabi representation within government offices is mostly from the Northern and Central Punjab, not the south punjab/seraiki heartlands. The 60-80% of the army staff being from Punjab generally means being from Rawalpindi, Chakwal, jhelum, Gujrat,Gujranwala, Lahore, Sargoda, Faisalabad and to a lesser extent Multan, Bahawalpur, D G Khan etc.
I do actually know a Pakhtun from Malakand in PAF and he daily suffers Pathan jokes to the extent tha he finds it humiliating. If he replies then theres a fight. he is not a commie or a show-shaw list Pakhtun btw. We allknow Pathan jokes are the most demeaning ethnic jokes as they are the ones you come across the most and they focus on mental ability.
pakhtuns from charsadda are probably bright because of ANP work there I believe. Is nt charsadda the ANP heartlands?
of course the tribal belt is at the bottom thanks to the government spending in the area and at times their own cultural hang ups.
Most of Pakistan wishes Musharaf had not slept with the Americans. You cant change history, you have to get a move on.
How can this thread be about the modern day people when you have decidedto it back to 1902?
Thanks. Yes Pakhtuns have done really well for sure. Anyone talking about discrimination against Pakhtuns must be living in either la la land, or Altaf Hussain's madeup world.
why because Pakhtuns (just like Punjabis and Urdu speaking) are the government. As you correctly said that army and bureucracy has a very large share of hard working Pakhtuns. It is only the new generation of socialists who want to raise the crap of discrimination.
Butt of jokes? Every ethnicity has their share of jokes. Is that one would call discrimination? Certainly not.
Probably the fewest jokes are about Balochis. May be no having jokes is the sign of the real discrimination.
Moreover Pakhtuns like any other ethnicity are not a monolithic group. For example Pakhtuns from charsadha are the best and brightest when it comes to education. While some tribal agencies are at the bottom of the heap.
Badshah Khan was a great leader and there is no question of disrespecting him in any way. Wish his son had not slept with socialists and communists that's all.
In any case Wali Khan played his role and now he has left the world (May Allah bless his soul).
This thread is much more about the modern day people. That we must know what we have in common vs. what we want to do to create differences.
Re: Sooba Sarhad was part of Sooba Punjab until 1902 - A bit of history
Posh, how can u left out Ajab Khan AFRIDI.
.......... .......... pakhtuns from charsadda are probably bright because of ANP work there I believe. Is nt charsadda the ANP heartlands? of course the tribal belt is at the bottom thanks to the government spending in the area and at times their own cultural hang ups. .......
Correction (respectfully), Charsaddah was the center of education and progress "long before" ANP.
Now you are disrespecting Charsddah's quest for learning.
FYI. Like any educated society, you find left leaning groups and off course right-leaning groups.
Left leaning or socialist type Charsaddha Pakhtuns joined left leaning parties. And one such party is ANP.
The right leaning Pakhtuns from Charsaddah and other areas joined right leaning groups.
.......... of course the tribal belt is at the bottom thanks to the government spending in the area and at times their own cultural hang ups. .......
Look we can blame the "government" for all the ills. And that may be true to some extent.
But here is the deal for you.
You go to any government office and tell them the following.
1. we'll pay all our bills (electric, water, gas, etc.)
2. we'll not kidnap engineers who come to our area for building roads
3. we'll not kill and kidnap woman teachers and lady doctors.
Then the progress will come to your area. However Tribal areas are such that even regular Pashto speaking people don't want to go there.
Engineers and government officials "deputized to build roads and schools" have been kidnapped in tribal area for decades if not centuries.
Then some apologist would turn around and blame the government. That's totally unfair, even by the lowly standards of Pak governments.
.......... You forget one major point which distorts the Punjab stats. Most of Punjabi representation within government offices is mostly from the Northern and Central Punjab, not the south punjab/seraiki heartlands. The 60-80% of the army staff being from Punjab generally means being from Rawalpindi, Chakwal, jhelum, Gujrat,Gujranwala, Lahore, Sargoda, Faisalabad and to a lesser extent Multan, Bahawalpur, D G Khan etc. ............
Let me give you an example closer to your place. Have you ever been to Silicon valley in California?
Here are some FACTS about this beautiful valley.
- There has been steady increase of Indian software techies over the last 40 years.
- Mostly these techies are Indian Hindus.
- Majority of these techies are from Indian south.
- Andhra perdesh dominates in the number of such techies
One can look at this and reach the following but incorrect conclusions.
The rest of the world is being discriminated by those who hire Indian techies. Arabs, Africans, etc were better techies but they were not hired because of their color or religion, or both.
Indian Muslims are being discriminated.
Indian north is being discriminated.
Southern states other than Andhra are being discriminated
But these are just incorrect conclusions.
In reality, people who really really want to the jobs get hired for the job.
And this is true for big $$ jobs, down to the $2 an hour farm jobs for the Mexicans.
So quit crying, and start working for the job you really want.
............ I do actually know a Pakhtun from Malakand in PAF and he daily suffers Pathan jokes to the extent tha he finds it humiliating. If he replies then theres a fight. he is not a commie or a show-shaw list Pakhtun btw. We allknow Pathan jokes are the most demeaning ethnic jokes as they are the ones you come across the most and they focus on mental ability. ....
I don't think you have heard jokes about Scotts, Irish, Polish, Sikhs, Panjabi villagers, and Urdu speakers.
Some of these are so raunchy that every part of the joke may need "Astaghfrullah" as a response from the audience.
In comparison Pathan jokes are almost PG rated compared to X-rated Mullah jokes and Sikh jokes.
So tell your friend to laugh it off and read up some dirty joke books. Next time someone tells him 1 Pathan joke, then instead of getting red-faced, and fuming, he should have some X-rated Mullah jokes ready to fire.
Tell him you are an officer in the Military, where people bond by telling dirty jokes about everything. Such is the life military men, as they know that war can break anytime, and their lives are at risk all the time. In that stressed environment, people give each other nicknames, tell dirty jokes, hand playboy centerfolds, smoke, drink etc. etc. throughout the world.
FYI. Joke telling is like story telling in a group of people. When someone tells a story, you have to add to it and tell a new story. And the fun goes on.
And you should be the last person complaining about jokes. Just have a second look at your nick. Wil ya?
bacha khan did not want to join with india. ...
Marwati, with due respect, you have not read the history of British-India.
Just a hint.
During 1946 (the most recent role of Badshah Khan), he was part of the Indian Congress team negotiating with Jinnah.
What was Indian congress's political stance in 1946?
From Khyber to Calcutta there is one country and that's all.
Indian Congress allowing Frontier to joining Afghanistan? simply haha- and then hahaha,
Your ill-thought statement would have brought a lot of rebuke by anyone with a single iota of knowledge. But one has to digress.
nice info
Look we can blame the "government" for all the ills. And that may be true to some extent.
But here is the deal for you. ?
Anti/Burqa You have the art of blaming the victim down to an artform! it's the art of blaming the person who gets robbed for leaving his door slightly ajar or the men who blame rape victims for the acts of the rapist. Or the apologists who blame political parties and civil society for martial laws. The silicon valley example is of a fair system where everyone (relatively) has a fair shot at things..comparing that to the Pakistani state system is a case of apples and oranges.
I don't think you have heard jokes about Scotts, Irish, Polish, Sikhs, Panjabi villagers, and Urdu speakers.
In comparison Pathan jokes are almost PG rated compared to X-rated Mullah jokes and Sikh jokes.
FYI. Joke telling is like story telling in a group of people. When someone tells a story, you have to add to it and tell a new story. *And the fun goes on. *
Your above comments in defense of racism of all sorts would be funny if they were not so tragic..racist language promotes polarization and hatred in society.
P.s: What is acceptable practice in silicon valley with regard to racist jokes.
........ Your above comments [about ethnic jokes] in defense of racism of all sorts would be funny if they were not so tragic..racist language promotes polarization and hatred in society.
P.s: What is acceptable practice in silicon valley with regard to racist jokes.
Off course the joke is only good if people listening to it, would enjoy them. It really depends on who the comedian is, and who are the audience. What is the setting? is it a theater, or a work place, a private party, or a restaurant, an army bunker, or a bomber flying 30,000 feet in the air, ready to drop its deadly payload.
You must look at the context before shooting off 'racism' racism' hi hi hi racism.
You jumped on silicon valley examples. Do you know that the office rules to deal with offensive jokes have only been in place for a few decades? Still the same rules do not apply to private parties, or army settings.
People who jump up and down 10 feet crying racism do not even know what racism is.
In Pakistan racism would exist if there were separate restaurants for different ethnicities. separate public facilities, if pakhtuns were denied army jobs, just because their ethnicity.
Telling an ethnic-joke is offensive and it should not be told if the audience is not receptive. No iffs and no butts.
However if someone on this board comes along and says that Pakhtuns are denied housing purely based on their ethnicity, or kicked out of jobs, or their kids are denied entrance to public schools. Then you have every right to complain.
Otherwise, you may be committing reverse racism.