Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

[Southie]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

i didnt know it was in mahabharat...i thought it was just a story...we had it as a short story when we were kids in those colorful hindi books.

So you learnt Hindi not Urdu?

[LP]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

@muqawwee123

so who demanded Eklavya’s thumb? What happened to his archery after he offered his thumb?

i dont rem the exact story…i was v young…around 8 yrs old maybe:bummer:

[LP]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

So you learnt Hindi not Urdu?

Yep..Hindi was compulsory as a second language till 8th grade...

[Southie]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

@muqawwee123

so who demanded Eklavya’s thumb? What happened to his archery after he offered his thumb?

Arjuna - one of the Pandavas demanded that his Guru ask for Ekalsvyas thumb as guru dakshina. Those days student gave their gurus some gift as appreciation.

I believe after giving thumb Ekalavya stopped being an archer.

Arjuna was not behaving as a Kshatriya!

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

@Southie

Syed Ali pyaar ka dushman hai hai
Meri jaan ka dushman
hai hai hai hai

kya hua? Is this some sort of jaloos against me?

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

Same is the case with Saansi people. I read they had to keep away themselves from other people, because touching a Saansi was considered bad. They need to be in corner and give way to the others while walking in same street.

Seems that human superiority concept is limited to ones own personality or the persons from his / her tribe. :(

I think our marasis, bhangis, choorhas and musallis etc would also belong to the lower castes.

[muqawwee123]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

I think our marasis, bhangis, choorhas and musallis etc would also belong to the lower castes.

If we see the history of religions, the first ones who adopt them are from lower castes and slaves. The groups you mentioned were degraded in sub-continent and therefore Christian missionaries were successful to convert them

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

Now the problem we have is that the ones who would have come into Islam have (some of them) changed their castes to something else out of shame I guess so much so it becomes very difficult to bifurcate between the people of lower castes who became muslims. Secondly in our villages we have some castes like nai, lohaar etc (based upon their profession) who form the different layers of the social fabric.

[the_kaur]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

@muqawwee123

Over the centuries the Punjab has been witness to large scale Dalit conversions to Islam, Sikhism and later to Christianity. Conversion divided Chuhras and Chamars into different religious categories and even different names were used for Chuhras belonging to different religions (i.e., Mussalli for the Muslims, Mazhabi for the Sikhs, Isai for the Christians, and Balmiki for those who kept to the
distinctive Chuhra religion.) Only Hindu and Sikh Dalits were included in the list of Scheduled Castes prepared by the Government of India after independence. Around 40% of the Dalits are Sikh by religion and practically all the Christians in Punjab are also Dalits. Christian Dalits were, however, kept out of the list of Scheduled Castes and were later included in the Backward Class category, creating a ground for discrimination against Christian Dalits. A good number of Dalits in the Punjab have converted to Buddhism in recent years.

Dalit Liberation

Casteism is so imbibed in our culture that conversion cannot eliminate the basics of it, I am against castiest discrimination but I am believer in caste, I am Jatt and their is always pride of being one, even in front of pundas:D

@ninja_hattori

Sorry My bad i posted another rumor…

@The Kaur…Dalit,bhangis all are part of shudra class…

BTW In lot of part dalits were supposed to clear caracass of dead animals…
Have you forget the recent killing of five dalits in jhajhjhar district of hariyana on suspicion of cow slaughter…
Where cow’s life was more precious than five fellow human beings…
Lot of atrocities happened with dalits…and we cant call them exaggerated…
They were not allowed to drink water from same sources…their housese used to be out side of towns and villages and that shows how they were insulted..

Dalit discriminate against Bhagis themselve, life of a pig is as important as human, in indian philosophy everything is created by god hence god see every creature with same eyes, Dalit got even ruled India they produced greatest leader like Mayawati,A Raja,Kanimozi etc:D

@muqawwee123

so who demanded Eklavya’s thumb? What happened to his archery after he offered his thumb?

Mahabharat closes his story there itself, I don’t remember if he is introduced ever again, though Krishna remains my favourite in the story because his personality sets the standard, he was Baap of Chankya in strategy:k:

[ninja_hattori]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

^:rotfl:

Have you seen any bhangi being killed for killing any pig…

Mayawati came to power few years back thank to strong pockets of dalits in Up…

BTW dr.B.R.Ambedkar lost Loksabha election from Vidarbha…reason was castism…

[ninja_hattori]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

@Dronacharya

@Ninja

1. Dalits are NOT Shudras.

2. Hindus killing because of a HOLY cow or Muslims killing others over “mistreatment” of HOLY paper derived from rags, grasses and wood. What’s the difference ?

3. Indian Muslims/Christians should first try to remove castism from their own communities before giving sermons to others.

New development

[the_kaur]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

@ninja_hattori

^:rotfl:

Have you seen any bhangi being killed for killing any pig…

Mayawati came to power few years back thank to strong pockets of dalits in Up…

BTW dr.B.R.Ambedkar lost Loksabha election from Vidarbha…reason was castism…

No, muslims can do so if it happens to be just outside their house, my point is that indian philosphy always maintained all lives are equal:)

Mayawati came to power because pundas voted in her favour to dislodge mulayam and even this time dalit voted for Mayawati and pundas dislodged Mayawati by voting back to BJP

Even Dimple Yadav lost faizabad because muslims voted for Raj Babbar and Legue won seats because of voting of muslims in Punjab 1946, hindus karein to casteism aur aap karein to insecurity of minority:hoonh:

try fighting Akalis in Moga or Phagwada, even gandhiji can’t win against them:D

[ninja_hattori]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

@the_kaur

No, muslims can do so if it happens to be just outside their house, my point is that indian philosphy always maintained all lives are equal:)

Mayawati came to power because pundas voted in her favour to dislodge mulayam and even this time dalit voted for Mayawati and pundas dislodged Mayawati by voting back to BJP

Even Dimple Yadav lost faizabad because muslims voted for Raj Babbar and Legue won seats because of voting of muslims in Punjab 1946, hindus karein to casteism aur aap karein to insecurity of minority:hoonh:

try fighting Akalis in Moga or Phagwada, even gandhiji can’t win against them:D

No muslim will kill any bhangi for just killing a pig…And muslim dont kill cows near hindu homes…
Yes but that followers of same philosophy for years discriminated against Dalits and thats truth…

I think even muslims did not vote in favor of mayawati this time…

Was not Dr.Ambedkar liable for being a M.P…and he was not fighting that election in any ones stronghold like Moga…
Why he lost was result of sheer castism…Did not you see Jayaprada won from Rampur?

I did not say muslim dont discriminate against any group among ourselves or muslim dont have castism…But topic of thread is saansi and discrimination against them…

if you want to point out and discuss discrimination by muslims you can go ahead and open a thread…

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

@the_kaur

Casteism is so imbibed in our culture that conversion cannot eliminate the basics of it, I am against castiest discrimination but I am believer in caste, I am Jatt and their is always pride of being one, even in front of pundas:D

Dalit discriminate against Bhagis themselve, life of a pig is as important as human, in indian philosophy everything is created by god hence god see every creature with same eyes, Dalit got even ruled India they produced greatest leader like Mayawati,A Raja,Kanimozi etc:D

Mahabharat closes his story there itself, I don’t remember if he is introduced ever again, though Krishna remains my favourite in the story because his personality sets the standard, he was Baap of Chankya in strategy:k:

who is Pundas?

[ninja_hattori]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

pundas=pundits=Brahmins

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

ok seedha saadha pundit kaho na... :)

[KKF]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

@Ali_Syed

ok seedha saadha pundit kaho na... :)

nai nai baba...ALL PunDits are Brahmans but ALL Brahmans are NOT PunDits! :)

[honeybeez]

Re: Saansi, Dalits & Atheism

Now the problem we have is that the ones who would have come into Islam have (some of them) changed their castes to something else out of shame I guess so much so it becomes very difficult to bifurcate between the people of lower castes who became muslims. Secondly in our villages we have some castes like nai, lohaar etc (based upon their profession) who form the different layers of the social fabric.

The vedic system of castes too was based on professions not just birth. A father usually taught his son and he in turn taught his son, just like present day family-owned businesses. The vedic system of caste division is in fact the first school that taught some of the so called HR (Human Resources) jargon like 'Organizational hierarchy', 'Organizational behaviour', 'team building', 'job profiles', etc to the world.