Rising food inflation

[ahmadjee]

Re: Rising food inflation

I was also told that the first mass demonstration aganist Ayub was when the suger price whet up 50 paisa. No Kiddin!

[garmihawathandapaani]

Re: Rising food inflation

@Fraudz

why is that? no really, why is it that we are whiners as a society. between whining, apathy, and burning cars and shops it doe snot look like there is a different thing that os done by the vast majority. Now here is where being someone who is a semi outsider comes into plI dont know why that is the case. could e a seperate topic, but I am interested inay. knowing people's opinion, why are the constructive activists a rarity?

Who do you mean by "semi outsider"?

As to Why is it - like children public needs some thing to hang there hopes on and look forward to. A nation is built not on 3 great leaders but the consistent contributions of a majority of population. Leaders inspire with optimism and the millions combine hope and energy to extrude progress out of ordinary day to day living.

A soul searching by a lot of people is required to honestly ask answer and adApt to what rational thinking dictates. Questions like are the issues on which money is spent and blood is spilt really worth it. What is true honor. How much andin what respects is it fair to ask certain society subsets to sacrifice. Who is playing pseudo messiah and what are the pseudo messages etc.

I know this much. I can motivate myself either for positive reasons (eg: I will exercise because I want to lead a healthy life) or for negative reasons (I'll learn karate so that I can beat up the guy down the street). Th elatter never lead to a good place.

I don't know who said it but more and more I realize means are as important as ends. In fact over a long enough they become indistinguishable.

[Mr_Fraudia]

Re: Rising food inflation

by semi outsider I mean I am not a 'native' I spent 2 years of my teens in Pak, and some winter breaks, but I can not ay I know it as well as people who were born and raised there.

as far as the rest of your post I agree with every thing you have written. I am asking why is it not so in pakistan. I dont know if my comparison is flawed but I compare US college stuents and high school students to those in Pakistan, and see activism, and charity, and social service here (yeah yeah in addition to sex, drugs and rock and roll) but in pakistan I see apathy, selfishness and destructive sort of activism (Jamiaat, APMSO, PSF etc) .. now this is not to ignore groups like PWA of dow medical at civil hospital, but I just dont see that activism, that social service.

I would admit, I dont know Pakistan well enough or deep enough and my assessment could be completely off base, but when I see students groups, fraternities, special interest clubs doing stuff like highway pickup, neighbourhood cleanups, habitat for humanity, relief for all kinds of charities, volunteering at soup kitchens, and then compare it to areas in Karachi which could be spruced up by a couple days of effort by youth in the area...and dont see it I wonder why. and these are not poor stressed our hand to mouth youth, I am talking middle class youth in gulshan and Fb area etc, who have tons of free time, evidenced by them wasting time on street corners every evening.

but, i could be completely wrong.

[Spock]

Re: Rising food inflation

@ahmadjee

I was always told that when Ayub took office, food prices fell. He did it with a danda. I was told that he posted army men on every major food mandi and made sure no one was selling some of the basics at a price higher than I guess authorized. First I want to know if this is true. Because his other economic policies were very liberal/capitalist and controlling prices at the market sounds too socialist.

I was also told that people in Pakistan do what in Urdu is called zakira andozi. i.e. keep the commodity out of market until the prices go up and then sell it to rake in better profits. And it was calimed that during Ayub's time it wasn't the case. Hummm

Its true! heard that from various sources. There was the famous cheeni incdent, there was a time when there was no sugar in the country, then ayub stepped in and had army wallaz making sure it was widely sold at the price they set, on 'rehris'! brilliant.

[garmihawathandapaani]

Re: Rising food inflation

^ If I may continue on this track.

You couldn't hvae picked a better example for what I am proposing.

However much we say it is motherhood and apple pie, so many more American kids grow up hearing and believing partly or fully in things like American dream, land of opportunity, aim high, no limits, mind is a terrible thing to waste etc. These are not just slogans - if you have lived a non-ameobic life in the US for any length of time you know these thing shave specific meanings and.....by jove, actually can be true. Operative words are Optimism + a low resource demand ratio (how many people are chasing how much).

In most 3rd world (excluding the abject poverty stricken ones where the problems are very different, I think) creating optimism is the turning point. China found optimism through cheap manufacture (west started objecting to sweatshops only after ensuring 'every day low prices); Japan found it through autos; Korea and other tigers through fab units and electronics; even India, the unlikeliest tiger I can think of, found something. And all of them turn this something into many things.

What is that fount of optimism for Pakistan? What is that something that ones found can launch the many things?

I don't literally mean one iPod or such magic bullet - hope you understand.

Now how the heck do we spread optimism into minds that are cobwebbed with pseudo-religious nonsense, that have no sense of self and self assurance? That is a great mindset to spread fear and status quo, not at all conducive for the inevitable ME and I ideas that need to stir in there.

I will say this. As long as we don't consider every mullah who starts rubbing his beard at the sound of anything progressive to be traitors, for each such mullah, we are confounding a whole neigborhood of minds out of the optimism track.

As long as we don't stop the lotas from picking up on Kashmir (which most of these guys don't even understand other than in simplistic terms) as a vote bank issue, all we are doing is confoudning more of the sheep to yet another generation of hate & loss cycle. What optimism? Where from?

Musharaf actually has the best chance - to keep onions in the pantry, religion in check, lotas in the toilet. But he needs some strategic company which unfortunately I do not believe (just my personal opinion) Shaukat is not able to provide, probably because he is a manager and not a visionary. He should focus all his talents to a.settling Kashmir which ever way it goes, rapidly. b.jail some high profile mullahs who try to corrupt youngsters and put religion in its place and c.announce 2 successors and start training them.

If he doesn't do these I'll have to sadly conclude he is no different from the others

Then it is truly a nation lost.

[vroom]

Re: Rising food inflation

[quote]
** view that food inflation in Pakistan is more a governance problem rather than economic as it demands improvement in supply chain system**.
[/quote]

why arnt the improvements being made? sounds as if it just requires legislation. possibly a situation for managers, directors to deal with rather then politicians come high profile personalities. aziz should be tasked with the job as a major priority. although hes just been making pakistan more business friendly, its maybe time to make exceptions

[Captain1]

Re: Rising food inflation

@Fraudz

why is that? no really, why is it that we are whiners as a society. between whining, apathy, and burning cars and shops it doe snot look like there is a different thing that os done by the vast majority. Now here is where being someone who is a semi outsider comes into play. I dont know why that is the case. could e a seperate topic, but I am interested in knowing people's opinion, why are the constructive activists a rarity?

I agree partly that we Pakistanis at large are more whiners then taking a step to solve the problem, but when I said what I said about milk prices going up and nobody will do anything.... it is very similar to what happened right here in US when gas prices shot up to more than $3 per gallon, it was a crisis, people were still driving, though they complained a lot but prices didn't come down .... prices eventually came down but not due to public cry but rather international market, so if gas prices had stayed at $3 people would have adapted to live with that fact though US media picks on such issues and keeps it alive. Though there are many other factors in the play ..... will continue my ramblings later, have to go for now.

[Mr_Fraudia]

Re: Rising food inflation

Captain

but the pricing for gas here was due to some free market economics and some hoarding which was taken very seriously, even became state level and fed level inquiries.

But cartel like price fixing here does not happen. If prices are increased arbritrarily, people speak up. Here in illinois as the utility rate freezes are ending there is a full force campaign for and against it. and this is not even some illegal price rising, ComEd has not had a price hike in years but people who are against it are well organized, coordinated and have become a force to be reckond with.

I think it can be a separate topic, but we just dont seem to work as well in pakistan. and I am not talking about the slums, I am talking middle class families, who are just on the sidelines and not doing much for themselves let alone doing anything altruistic.

[Mr_Fraudia]

Re: Rising food inflation

btw garamhaw dude, excellent post. excellent

[Captain1]

Re: Rising food inflation

@Fraudz

Captain

but the pricing for gas here was due to some free market economics and some hoarding which was taken very seriously, even became state level and fed level inquiries.

But cartel like price fixing here does not happen. If prices are increased arbritrarily, people speak up. Here in illinois as the utility rate freezes are ending there is a full force campaign for and against it. and this is not even some illegal price rising, ComEd has not had a price hike in years but people who are against it are well organized, coordinated and have become a force to be reckond with.

I agree that the price swing was due to international market, but there was also a very short span around hurrican Katrina/Rita when the gas prices went up to $5 per gallon in some areas and still people lined up for few hours. I also agree that if prices were to be manipulated by cartel or perhaps memory prices fixing by Samsung (was it??) and other vendors are investigated and culprits punished.

The only similarity was that though prices went up people were still consuming gas as usual, limited cut-down occurred and had prices stayed that high people wouldn't have stopped driving or knocked on oil companies doors to bring prices down, that job is very well done by media and govt agencies if any foul play is detected.

The problem in Pakistan is that nobody trusts governmen, public does not have a united front. I believe there is a consumer price watch agency who monitors prices esp during Ramadan and "punishes" price gougers but you may have heard that prices still go up every ramadan nonetheless.

You may have heard about govt of Pakistan exporting sugar/onion to India while local market didn't have sufficient to meet the demands, isn't that unbelievable? And to top it off, some of it was re-imported. Now you can sense that its not just local mafia manipulating prices.