Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

GoldenAsif · June 26, 2012, 8:10pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

Read as follows:

Judicial Coup in Pakistan | The Pakistan Update

**Judicial Coup in Pakistan
Tuesday, February 23rd, 2010
By David B. Rivkin Jr. and Lee A. Casey
**

When U.S. President Barack Obama sharply challenged a recent Supreme Court decision in his State of the Union address, prompting a soto voce rejoinder from Justice Samuel Alito, nobody was concerned that the contretemps would spark a blood feud between the judiciary and the executive. The notion that judges could or would work to undermine a sitting U.S. president is fundamentally alien to America’s constitutional system and political culture. Unfortunately, this is not the case in Pakistan.

**Supreme Court Chief Justice Iftikhar Mohammed Chaudhry, the country’s erstwhile hero, is the leading culprit in an unfolding constitutional drama. It was Mr. Chaudhry’s dismissal by then-President Pervez Musharraf in 2007 that triggered street protests by lawyers and judges under the twin banners of democracy and judicial independence. This effort eventually led to Mr. Musharraf’s resignation in 2008. Yet it is now Mr. Chaudhry himself who is violating those principles, having evidently embarked on a campaign to undermine and perhaps even oust President Asif Ali Zardari.
Any involvement in politics by a sitting judge, not to mention a chief justice, is utterly inconsistent with an independent judiciary’s proper role. What is even worse, Chief Justice Chaudhry has been using the court to advance his anti-Zardari campaign. Two recent court actions are emblematic of this effort.

The first is a decision by the Supreme Court, announced and effective last December, to overturn the “National Reconciliation Ordinance.” The NRO, which was decreed in October 2007, granted amnesty to more than 8,000 members from all political parties who had been accused of corruption in the media and some of whom had pending indictments.

While some of these people are probably corrupt, many are not and, in any case, politically inspired prosecutions have long been a bane of Pakistan’s democracy. The decree is similar to actions taken by many other fledgling democracies, such as post-apartheid South Africa, to promote national reconciliation. It was negotiated with the assistance of the United States and was a key element in Pakistan’s transition from a military dictatorship to democracy.

Chief Justice Chaudhry’s decision to overturn the NRO, opening the door to prosecute President Zardari and all members of his cabinet, was bad enough. But the way he did it was even worse. Much to the dismay of many of the brave lawyers who took to the streets to defend the court’s integrity last year, Mr. Chaudhry’s anti-NRO opinion also blessed a highly troubling article of Pakistan’s Constitution—Article 62. This Article, written in 1985, declared that members of parliament are disqualified from serving if they are not of “good character,” if they violate “Islamic injunctions,” do not practice “teachings and practices, obligatory duties prescribed by Islam,” and if they are not “sagacious, righteous and non-profligate.” For non-Muslims, the Article requires that they have “a good moral reputation.”

Putting aside the fact that Article 62 was promulgated by Pakistan’s then ruling military dictator, General Zia ul-Haq, relying on religion-based standards as “Islamic injunctions” or inherently subjective criteria as “good moral reputation” thrusts the Pakistani Supreme Court into an essentially religious domain, not unlike Iranian Sharia-based courts. This behavior is profoundly ill-suited for any secular court. While Article 62 was not formally repealed, it was discredited and in effect, a dead letter. The fact that the petitioner in the NRO case sought only to challenge the decree based on the nondiscrimination clause of the Pakistani Constitution and did not mention Article 62 makes the court’s invocation of it even more repugnant. Meanwhile, the decision’s lengthy recitations of religious literature and poetry, rather than reliance on legal precedent, further pulls the judiciary from its proper constitutional moorings.

The second anti-Zardari effort occurred just a few days ago, when the court blocked a slate of the president’s judicial appointments. The court’s three-Justice panel justified the move by alleging the president failed to “consult” with Mr. Chaudhry. This constitutional excuse has never been used before.

It is well-known in Islamabad that Mr. Zardari’s real sin was political, as he dared to appoint people unacceptable to the chief justice. Since consultation is not approval, Mr. Chaudhry’s position appears to be legally untenable. Yet Mr. Zardari, faced with demonstrations and media attacks, let Mr. Chaudhry choose a Supreme Court justice.

There is no doubt that the chief justice is more popular these days than the president, who has been weakened by the split in the political coalition which brought down Mr. Musharraf. Former Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif is now a leading opponent of the regime. There is a strong sense among the Pakistani elites that Justice Chaudhry has become Mr. Sharif’s key ally.

The fact that Mr. Chaudhry was a victim of an improper effort by former President Musharraf to replace him with a more pliant judge makes his current posture all the more deplorable. His conduct has led some of his erstwhile allies to criticize him and speak of the danger to democracy posted by judicial meddling in politics. The stakes are stark indeed. If Mr. Chaudhry succeeds in ousting Mr. Zardari, Pakistan’s fledgling democracy would be undermined and the judiciary’s own legitimacy would be irrevocably damaged. Rule by unaccountable judges is no better than rule by the generals.**

–
Messrs. Rivkin and Casey, Washington, D.C.-based attorneys, served in the Department of Justice during the Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush administrations. This piece was published in The Wall Street Journal

Regardless of how bad or corrupt Zardari/PPP Government is, one MUST look at the whole thing with an open mind

**When appointing judges to the Supreme Court, the President is only obliged to ‘consult’ the CJ for advice but he doesn’t need his (CJ’s) approval or permission for anything and CJ Iftikhar is clearly exceeding his domain here **(the red bold part)

Robin_Hood · June 26, 2012, 8:23pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

There is great history in Pakistan about judiciary .
From Muneer to Iftekhar .
Aah Iftekhar
Twice took an oath as a PCO judge and also allowed Mush to amend the constitution .t he
But every one from Lahore Province is fine

Anwer_Pasha · June 26, 2012, 9:26pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

O ji , Kia keh dia ,
Yeh sab siraf main keh sakta hoon .

chacha_Ghalib · June 27, 2012, 4:36am

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

But the CJ is a saint and can do no wrong. Therefore, if he's doing something, he must be right cause you know only he knows the constitution. And it's blasphemy to talk ill of hazrat ifti.

Anwer_Pasha · June 27, 2012, 5:18am

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

And CJ takes start;
Asked PM today to report about the compliance on NRO case .
My prediction
This time PIndi will win .

Ali_Syed · June 27, 2012, 10:20am

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

We will see what will happen. Will the next elections be under Bangladesh model or under the CEC/interim government installed by the present regime.

CM · June 27, 2012, 12:28pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

Yes yes. Gorays definitely know more about Pakistan and its politics than Pakistanis living in Pakistan.

Anwer_Pasha · June 27, 2012, 1:11pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

This time Pindi means 'Pindi Alliance' which ousted Makhdoom Shahab and picked up Raja .

Ali_Syed · June 27, 2012, 1:13pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

bhai aapka takht e Multan bhi nahin chaahta tha, he wanted all the cake for himself (and his kids).

Sachaydino · June 27, 2012, 2:13pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

Do you have any doubt about this? Gora covers all aspects of the situation unlike with a very few exceptions, majority of local bullsh!ters whose views are biased, ethnic oriented, always lie about Pakistani political situation.

Sachaydino · June 27, 2012, 2:15pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

Someone even call me Anwar Pasha using another nick as Sachaydino:)

yazdi · June 29, 2012, 9:17am

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

1) The analysis of the Indian judge is based on the notion that the PM was ousted because he ridiculed the SC in literal manner. He did not consider that PM was just disqualified from the parliament being convicted by the SC. This disqualification from the parliament has been done in many countries including India when the question of eligibility arises. Yousuf Raza Gilani was ousted from the PM post because being convicted he was no longer eligible to remain a member of Parliament just like some other members have been disqualified from the parliament for holding dual nationality. The only difference between these members and YRG is that the later was the PM of Pakistan.

2) I have heard three most prominent lawyers in Pakistan whom I respect the most and are totally unbiased when they give their legal opinions. They are Babar Sattar, Farogh Naseem, and Salman Akram Raja. All three of them have consensus that issue of immunity has not been touched by Supreme Court in any manner what so ever. True that the President has immunity in our constitution according to article 248.

3) Writing a letter by no means implies the Presidential immunity is questioned. SC has directed the government to write a letter to Swiss authorities to withdraw the earlier letter by then attorney general of Pakistan who withdrew claim of Pakistan government from 60 million dollars deposited by SGS/Cotecna in the accounts of BB/Zardari. This was withdrawn because of defunct NRO which was declared void ab initio by Supreme Court of Pakistan.

4) All these three imminent lawyers think that SC has not touched the immunity in any of their verdicts. Probably the SC is implying by writing the letter to the Swiss authorities State of Pakistan wants to restore their claim on this amount. As the President enjoys International immunity, it's most likely that Swiss courts will not start these legal proceedings against our present President Zardari., but whenever they do after the ouster of Zardari from Presidential office... State of Pakistan will remain a claimant of this money which rightly belongs to the people of Pakistan. The claim was wrongly withdrawn due to a void ab initio legislation NRO.

5) The final authority to interpret the constitution is Supreme Court of Pakistan as per the constitution of Pakistan. No individual can interpret the constitution on their own against the interpretation of Supreme Court of Pakistan. All the decisions of Supreme Court of Pakistan are binding on the executive for implementation. One may think the decisions to be biased.. but this can not be used as the pretext not to abide these decisions as per our constitution. The government is violating the constitution clearly in this case by using this pretext not to implement the clear court order.

Therefore conviction of the Prime Minister was totally justified. As a result of this conviction the eligibility of the PM to remain a member of parliament was decided resulting him to lose the office of PM. It's good to see the law taking it's course in Pakistan and things are being settled in strictly legal manner..

CM · June 29, 2012, 10:25am

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

The irony is lost on you that you said that right?

Sachaydino · June 29, 2012, 12:37pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

What that suppose to mean?

Sachaydino · June 29, 2012, 12:44pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

yazdi:

2) I have heard three most prominent lawyers in Pakistan whom I respect the most and are totally unbiased when they give their legal opinions. They are Babar Sattar, Farogh Naseem, and Salman Akram Raja. All three of them have consensus that issue of immunity has not been touched by Supreme Court in any manner what so ever. True that the President has immunity in our constitution according to article 248.

3) Writing a letter by no means implies the Presidential immunity is questioned. SC has directed the government to write a letter to Swiss authorities to withdraw the earlier letter by then attorney general of Pakistan who withdrew claim of Pakistan government from 60 million dollars deposited by SGS/Cotecna in the accounts of BB/Zardari. This was withdrawn because of defunct NRO which was declared void ab initio by Supreme Court of Pakistan.

Contradiction in above paragraphs. jis cj ki baat kar rahay ho uska apna daaman paak nahin hay. The only reason your supporting this corrupt CJ is that he is Chaudhry. is ki chrri sirf gilani aor zardari par chalti hay. In his more than 41/2 years he has only after Zardari out of 8000 cases. The other parties are more criminally involved but he has wasted his time on Zardari. After his son's corruption, he has no moral grounds to continue his position and give judgements on others.

chacha_Ghalib · June 30, 2012, 6:04pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

How to increase traffic in our forums

The analysis of the Indian judge is based on the notion that the PM was ousted because he ridiculed the SC in literal manner. He did not consider that PM was just disqualified from the parliament being convicted by the SC. This disqualification from the parliament has been done in many countries including India when the question of eligibility arises. Yousuf Raza Gilani was ousted from the PM post because being convicted he was no longer eligible to remain a member of Parliament just like some other members have been disqualified from the parliament for holding dual nationality. The only difference between these members and YRG is that the later was the PM of Pakistan.

I have heard three most prominent lawyers in Pakistan whom I respect the most and are totally unbiased when they give their legal opinions. They are Babar Sattar, Farogh Naseem, and Salman Akram Raja. All three of them have consensus that issue of immunity has not been touched by Supreme Court in any manner what so ever. True that the President has immunity in our constitution according to article 248.

Writing a letter by no means implies the Presidential immunity is questioned. SC has directed the government to write a letter to Swiss authorities to withdraw the earlier letter by then attorney general of Pakistan who withdrew claim of Pakistan government from 60 million dollars deposited by SGS/Cotecna in the accounts of BB/Zardari. This was withdrawn because of defunct NRO which was declared void ab initio by Supreme Court of Pakistan.

All these three imminent lawyers think that SC has not touched the immunity in any of their verdicts. Probably the SC is implying by writing the letter to the Swiss authorities State of Pakistan wants to restore their claim on this amount. As the President enjoys International immunity, it’s most likely that Swiss courts will not start these legal proceedings against our present President Zardari., but whenever they do after the ouster of Zardari from Presidential office… State of Pakistan will remain a claimant of this money which rightly belongs to the people of Pakistan. The claim was wrongly withdrawn due to a void ab initio legislation NRO.

The final authority to interpret the constitution is Supreme Court of Pakistan as per the constitution of Pakistan. No individual can interpret the constitution on their own against the interpretation of Supreme Court of Pakistan. All the decisions of Supreme Court of Pakistan are binding on the executive for implementation. One may think the decisions to be biased.. but this can not be used as the pretext not to abide these decisions as per our constitution. The government is violating the constitution clearly in this case by using this pretext not to implement the clear court order.

Therefore conviction of the Prime Minister was totally justified. As a result of this conviction the eligibility of the PM to remain a member of parliament was decided resulting him to lose the office of PM. It’s good to see the law taking it’s course in Pakistan and things are being settled in strictly legal manner..

Good analysis yazdi :k:

I just think that the SC seems a little biased against PPP. I think the CJ is picking the wrong fight. He should have focused on reforming the lower judiciary instead of being in a constant battle with the government over a non-issue. The letter could have been written after zardari ceased being a president. No biggie there.

One thing that I absolutely hate is how SC is being treated as the only court in the country. Any lallu panju goes straight to the SC instead of going to the lower courts first. what’s even more revolting is that the SC seems ever ready, especially if the matter concerns PPP. Here in Canada, our supreme court decides which cases are worth hearing and which ones have been satisfactorily settled by the lower judiciary.

Anwer_Pasha · July 3, 2012, 4:30pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

[LIST]

                 ججوں کو پلاٹوں کی الاٹمنٹ، تفصیلات پارلیمنٹ کے پاس](http://www.bbc.co.uk/urdu/pakistan/2012/07/120703_pac_judges_sa.shtml)

We are different people

                 اسی بارے میں

ججوں جرنیلوں سمیت تمام ملازمین اثاثے ظاہر کریں](ججوں جرنیلوں سمیت تمام ملازمین اثاثے ظاہر کریں - BBC News اردو)
ججوں اور جرنیلوں کے اثاثے](BBC Urdu)

[/LIST]

Sachaydino · July 3, 2012, 8:21pm

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

Sub se pehlay CJ and CAOS apnay assasay zahir karay taake doosray judge aor wardi waalay un ko follow karen.

CM · July 4, 2012, 12:28am

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

It means you post purely on biased ethnic lines with no real idea about Pakistani politics. You merely support whatever the PPP does. No matter how bad it is for the country.

Sachaydino · July 4, 2012, 1:00am

Re: Retired Indian Supreme court judge deprecates Pak SC verdict on Gilani‎

blah blah blah