'Regime change' in Spain as ruling party ousted

Yes, like dominos they seem to be falling, Honduras and Nicaragua, with El Salvador probably not far behind.

Honduras plans to follow the lead of Spain and withdraw its 370 troops from Iraq by the end of June, Defence Secretary Federico Breve said today. The decision marked an about-face from a day earlier when President Ricardo Maduro said Honduran forces would stay. Today’s announcement “coincides with the decision of the prime minister-elect of the Spanish government,” Breve said.](Breaking News - Headlines & Top Stories | The Star)

Spain’s Zapatero Rejects Bush Appeal on Iraq calls it a fiasco

Monkey will be jumping from tree to tree until it also kicked out.

Spain’s Zapatero Rejects Bush Appeal on Iraq
Wed Mar 17, 8:23 AM ET Add Top Stories - Reuters to My Yahoo!

By Daniel Flynn

MADRID (Reuters) - Spain’s incoming prime minister Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero Wednesday rebuffed an appeal from President Bush (news - web sites) to stand by the U.S.-led occupation of Iraq (news - web sites), which he described as a “fiasco.”
“I will listen to Mr Bush but my position is very clear and very firm,” Zapatero told Onda Cero radio. “The occupation is a fiasco. There have been almost more deaths after the war than during the war.”

Zapatero, who is due to take office next month after an unexpected election win Sunday, has pledged to withdraw some 1,300 Spanish troops from Iraq by July 1 if the United Nations (news - web sites) does not take charge there.

Tuesday, Bush called on Spain and other allies in Iraq not to yield to pressure from al Qaeda by pulling their troops from the coalition occupying the turbulent country.

“My position is the same. I have explained it throughout the election campaign,” he said. “The occupying forces have not allowed the United Nations to take control of the situation.”

The Socialist leader unexpectedly won Sunday’s election amid outcry over a suspected al Qaeda bombing which killed 201 people. The attack revived public opposition to Spain’s presence in Iraq.

The White House said it may seek a new U.N. resolution before it hands back sovereignty to Iraqis by the end of June to persuade allies such as Spain not to withdraw.

It has cautioned Spain and other allies not to send the message that “terrorists” can influence their policies.

ABOUT TURN FOR SPAIN

Zapatero’s swift pledge after Sunday’s election to pull troops from Iraq if conditions did not change was an about-turn from outgoing Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar’s unflinching support for Bush’s foreign policy.

But Zapatero insisted his stance on Iraq was not a reaction to the rush-hour train attacks, but rather a point of principle.

“Fighting terrorism with bombs, with operations of ‘shock and awe’, with missiles, that does not combat terrorism it only generates more radicalism,” the 43-year-old Socialist leader said.

“The way to fight terrorism is with the rule of law, with international legislation, with intelligence services,” he said. “This is what the international community should be talking about.”

Zapatero swept to power amid public anger at the government’s handling of Thursday’s bombing, which it continued to blame on armed Basque separatists ETA despite mounting evidence of the involvement of Islamic militants.

What does this have to do with Little Kim? Quit diverting the subject.

^ You seeing things

*"The occupation is a fiasco. There have been almost more deaths after the war than during the war." *

Now there is a leader who speaks the truth.

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by Malik73: *
*
"The occupation is a fiasco. There have been almost more deaths after the war than during the war." **

Now there is a leader who speaks the truth.
[/QUOTE]

Just wait a little longer, soon he will be labled, a terrorist, a rogue a retard... Do spaniards eat French fries ooops I mean freedom fries? :)

I am now boycotting Spanish Rice. Mexican Rice is better anyway. :yummy:

:hehe: I think Spain will now be tossed back into “old Europe” after a stint in the “new” club. But with a score of Spanish-speaking countries in Latin America very likely to follow Spain’s lead and withdraw their troops as well, the American’s will more than ever reliant on their Mongolian, Micronensian and Nauruan allies.

Adios...

[thumb=E]3losers11340_6921719.JPG[/thumb]

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Seminole: *
The greatest terrorist of all? Your bias is laughable. Check out the murdering machines in history. I don't expect you to understand the responsbility of being the world's dominant power and the reason most of the world is either democratic or becoming democratic. It's an awesome responsiblity and it's not always pretty. But it sure beats sitting around and letting tyrants and terrorists control the world.
[/QUOTE]

... is Shock and Awe not terrorism?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by the real AK47: *

... is Shock and Awe not terrorism?
[/QUOTE]

Shock and Awe was an attack directly targetted against a regime that was responsible for the killing of hundreds of thousands. Tragically there were innocents killed. And I think one could argue that killing even one innocent (a child in particular) could not justify any of this war.

But I think serious people could not call it terrorism.

Intentional tagetting, murder and maiming of innocent people (women and children) without warning as they go about their day I think clearly falls into the category of terrorism.

This is an old point of contention here. So I will only speak for myself. The hearts of those responsible for Iraq War were filled with conflict regarding the safety or well being of innocent people. This doesn't justify the end result neccesarily.

The hearts of those who bomb innocents I don't think are not filled with similar conflict. Moreso with an abject hatred.

I see a large difference between the two.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by storch: *

I see a large difference between the two.
[/QUOTE]

You are right there is a difference between the two, one is terrorism, the other is terrorism on a grander scale.

Alrighty.

Spain's retreat in the face of terrorism threatens to put them into the European cowardly military failures of history previously dominated by France. I would not be surprised if France caves into the the extremist Muslim group that threatened attacks that would make "blood run to its borders" and repeal the recent hijab law. If Europe continues this weak-kneed kowtowing to terrorists, God help us all. It appears if the clash of civiliaztions is in full swing.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Seminole: *
Spain's retreat in the face of terrorism...
[/QUOTE]

Not really. The new Spanish government is fulfilling the policy i.e. of withdrawing Spanish troops from Iraq that it has long campaigned for, ever since the start of this war, and before the terrorist attacks. Additionally, a host of Spanish-speaking countries are also likely to withdraw their troops, and they can hardly be accused of retreating in the face of terrorism as well? Nobody in Europe (apart from the British possibly) is going to do a Vietnam.

Jihadi brigades online seem to be celebrating as if Spain has fallen into Islamic lap undoing the last 5 centuries of history. They see it a western kafir state falling on its knees in front of their jihadi courage and valor. They feel vindicated that their path of violence and terrorism is correct because it is working. Further to draw a wedge in the western states they might decide to SPARE Spain from future retribution for soem time and concentrate on other avenues like France and UK.
Spaniards who helped this outcome are gravely mistaken. I think it is not a decision that Spaniards took, to vote out their govt based on this one incident, after lot of debate..it was done in a hurry, under panic and in a very confusing situation when it was not even known who did it. They very well might regret it coming months.
Also not participating in Iraq war does not mean they are going to quit fighting against Al-qaeda and other terrorists. They might become more revengefull as for as AQ is concerned.

Friedmans phrase in the NYT today, "The Axis of Appeasement".

The new Spanish govt is in power because of the mass murder 3 days before the elections by Muslim extremists. Stabilizing Iraq has nothing to do with Vietnam. What iI appears like is that nobody in Europe is going to stick with the Iraqi people and enusre a stable and democratic future.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Seminole: *
What iI appears like is that nobody in Europe is going to stick with the Iraqi people and enusre a stable and democratic future.
[/QUOTE]

Correction. Nobody in Europe is prepared any longer to take part in the slaughter of Iraqi people carried out by the US military in the last year, which has resulted in the mass murder of over 10,000 people.

Btw, countries like Spain, France, the UK etc have been fighting terrorism at home for decades, even while (in the case of the UK) American groups were funding some of these terrorists. So don't underestimate their desire to tackle terrorism.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Malik73: *

Correction. Nobody in Europe is prepared any longer to take part in the slaughter of Iraqi people carried out by the US military in the last year, which has resulted in the mass murder of over 10,000 people.

Btw, countries like Spain, France, the UK etc have been fighting terrorism at home for decades, even while (in the case of the UK) American groups were funding some of these terrorists. So don't underestimate their desire to tackle terrorism.
[/QUOTE]
By all accounts (and according to an overwhelming majority of Iraqis) if the security provided by the coalition leaves then the country will fall into chaos. The casualties caused by the US military, while sad and unfortunate, sill represent a small fraction of the Iraqis that were slaughtered on an annual basis when Saddam was in power.

The slaughtering going on today in Iraq is neither by Saddam or the US, but by Muslim extremists. Spain pulling out does nothing to help the innocent Iraqis. On the contrary in emboldens the terrorists and will probably cause more deaths.