How many of y’all believe in kismet or fate and to what extent? I believe that everything is up to Allah (of course) but also that God helps those who help themselves.
This “tug of war” has been on my mind for a long time. Any (decent) thoughts?
fate does exist.. atleast the fate written in genes.
Fatte exists in curruption!!!! IT'S TRUE! Oh and maybe communism.....
Last week I had a two hour discussion with few of my learned muslim friends. We came to the following conclusion :
1) ALLAH Almighty is all knowing and he "KNOWS" every thing about a person (including his destiny in the a day of judgement). He knows a person's intention,
his goals and the final outcome of each of his actions.
2) Human being and other creation of ALLAH work on the basis of Time, Goals, Achievements and desires. Though Allah knows the final outcome of every action we take (Since He is all knowing (not bound with time parameter as he knows the future and the past)), the outcome of each activity is partially governed by our action. So it is true that Allah knows the final outcome, destiny etc. but it is we who materialize it (with Gods will) by our action.
3) Our destiny in our eyes could be dynamic
(changing with our actions) but in the Allah's view (who created the time) it is already known.
4) In the day of Judgement we will be held responsible for each action that we took.
And our action will justify the destiny that Allah knew all along during our life time.
5) We must strive to please Allah and do the
good deeds so that with God's will our "destiny" will be Jannat
[This message has been edited by Sukhunwar (edited 09-02-98).]
wow...Sukhunwar summed it all up! :)i don't think anything else needs to be said now; i totally agree with sukhunwar...
Yes, especially point #4.
Thank you!
Mind if I play devil's advocate?
If we are born with a pre-determined destiny, how can Allah hold us responsible for our actions on the day of judgement?
Can a benevolent and compassionate Allah be so unjust. For a child born into this world, destined to live a life of sin would then answer on that day, "O, Allah, I did as you had intended me to do. How can you send me to hell's fire if my fate was pre-written by you before I entered this world?"
Muzna,
Salam,
My name is Minhaj . How are you ? You brought forward the issue of predestination. A subject that has bothered me for a long time. The best explanaition I have heard so far is from this example.
Think of God as a Programmer and we are the finished programme running according to the script written by God. Our choices are rewarded or punished by a seires of
IF Statements . I am sure you are aware of the IF statements used in Programming.
If the Script of life was written in Unix or C it would be something like this :
If he sleeps around
echo Lightening from the sky
else
echo Azan from the mosque
if he gives to the poor
Give ten fold back
else
make him poor ........
I think you get the general idea . I hope I am making some sence here ! So this is how I see Predestination as a seires of If statements by the Great Programmer in the Sky. What do you think ?
Minhaj
Well this is the only word i never understood (interms of real meaning) our religion says that every thing is written up there, thn why i will be punished if i commit a sin, why God will punish me for that, when he wrote it in there... thn question comes did we bring our kismat pre written or can we change it... this questions will never be answered if we get it is our kismat, if dont wasn't kismat... i think there is a little difference between kismat and naseeb... if not thn there should be a difference... what i think is that we can change our kismat... like i did some efforts to get to this gupshup group and meet you nice ppls so what you say is this kismat or i made my way...
Yeah! I'm with you Naseer. You kind of right when talking about corrupton because when you want something why don't you just bribe someone and FOR SURE YOU'LL GET IT! Communism could be?
I do not accept the concept of fate.
It would take me a lot to write,to express my opinion on that, and I am not in the mood to do that at midnite.Trust me there is a very sound ,logical, way of understanding this(not for those who are not open to any idea other than Islam)or those who dont have the required capacity of understanding the abstract concepts, needed to conceptualize it.Anyway I will get into it tomorrow.
sweet dreams
Minhaj, I love it! I'm not a programmer shrogrammer, but that explanation makes a lot of sense.
I guess the reason I posted the topic was to see what various people's opinion was as to
AT WHAT POINT do we take our destiny into our own hands? When are we defying our pre-written destiny? Should we wait endlessly for things to happen on their own or take that risk where we stand a 50-50 chance of doing right or wrong?
First we must define the "Kismat" and/or "Fate". We know that Allah Almighty has all the power and knowledge. Things beyond our power are defined by these words. But, we must remember that being "Khalifat-ul-Allah" we human being also possess certain power, that enable us to decide/dictat the fate of certain things.
SSS, I believe in it, I also believe that by following the right path we can shape the fate/kismat to a certain degree.
To me Kismet is simply the fact (I use the word loosely) that Allah knows what will happen to me tommorow.
Kismet does not absolve an individual from personal responsibility. Allah knows whether I'm going to actually carry out that burglary (an example of course ) tommorow but the choice is still mine. If I carry out the burglary I can't say in my defense that Allah knew but didn't stop me so I should be set free.
Farouq Taj.
I believe in kismet.
Munza,
In point (1), I purposefully used the word "KNOWS" because in our current time dimension "perspective" it is we who
are shaping our future by our actions.
But ALLAH almighty, the all knowing,
the creator knows exactly what the outcome
of our each action is. That does not mean he
is "making" us follow the path that would lead to our outcome; it is we who take the actions that finally leads (of course with GOD's will) to the outcome. Since Allah is not bound with the time constraint, his
knowing of our destiny is in no way should be considerd by us as pre-determined destiny. In our perspective (which is bound with Time dimension)our destiny is dynamic, changes with our actions.
It is very difficult for us to comprehend
the concept that ALLAH knows the future that
we keep "changing" with our actions. So it
is dynamic for us but for Allah (not bound with time constraint) it is all "known" not
all destined.
Kismat can be changed with real duaa to Allah and hard work..i believe in this. If kismatt was set with no options of changes in it, then why would there be prayers ( duua)??
Salam
Doosto I am back.
The most beautiful description of the concept was given by a Greek when he said
Everything is a product of chance and necessity.
Khuda ka naam mano,aur hur baat main us becharry ko na ghaseeto.
Fate is the word used to describe ,events that one faces, that are beyond its control.We are not bothered when these are going in a predictable way,and in accordance with our goals.Problem comes up ,when something happens that is too good or too bad. Why me? This probably was the question ,to answer which ,this term was coined
When there is one in a million chance of something happening,it would happen one time in a million ,to someone somewhere and leave him with the question.and the answer is simple,it could be anyone ,happens to be you.
The flow of nature does not care for individuals,it only cares for the greater hum.
We all have goals and fantasies, if we judge the variants right,we probably wouldnt have to ask the question (why me) too many times.Go for something that is beyond your limitations,and every other line from your mouth would be that.
whatever we do shapes our future,both immediate and remote.WE LIVE IN A "judgement day".
When something ,that doesnt usually happen starts happening often,look hard and you will find a reason for it.
The concept of fate is a chain of gold,it takes away part of the responsibility from you , but at the same time doesnt let you look at some of your own shortcomings.
Nature has a different place and method to us,than we tend to think as individuals.This difference,allows the misperceptions,that go in our idea of the world,our own place and role,with consequent Disappointments.
Our need to keep the grandious delusions about ourselves going ,has kept the concept of fate alive.
[This message has been edited by Quark (edited 09-03-98).]
Okay! Fortune-teller,
What's our Muzna's FATE?
Answer the question!
Assalam alaikum
Allah (S.W.T.) is Just. We will only be judged on our intentions and actions so if something is written for us and we have no control over it then why worry about it?
Also some people seem to think that our actions and intentions are written in our fate, this is a wrong approach to this subject. If our actions were predestined then why would we be judged over what we have no control over. Allah (S.W.T.) has given us Free will this means we are free to do whatever we want but the price of paradise is giving up this freedom and submitting to Allah's Will.
We are tested with good times and bad times and our reaction to this is what we are judged upon i.e. whether we take a Halaal route to solve the problem or we take a Haraam route to solve the problem. Halaal will take us to Jannah and Haraam will take us to Jahannum.
kh.