Ismaili religious beliefs

Society Religion & Philosophy
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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

What Political Point ?

There are many Core belief elements of Muslims … when we talk about Salat/ Salaah .. there are many muslim faiths other than just Sunnis on how Salaat is performed … or is there just one? and the ONLY one?

SURAH 2 AL- BAQARAT ( THE COW), AYAT 177
It is not righteousness that you turn your faces towards East or West;
But it is righteousness to believe in Allah, and in the Last Day,
And in the Angels, and the Book, and the Messengers;
To spend of your substance out of your love for him,
For your kin, for orphans, for the needy, for the wayfarer,
Nor transgressing due limits, then he is guiltless,
For Allah is Oft-forgiving, most Merciful.

And there are many verses … When I look at this verse and the essence of Quran, the reality of the world, the pluralistic view etc … I think that Aga khani’s echo the message of Islam to the world …The aga khan development network is one example of it … http://www.akdn.org/

These are again just my views as I have been involved with them since ages …

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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

Shahada means declaration of faith, it is not something you believe in, it is something that is done.

"La ilaha ilAllah" literally it means"there is no deity except The Deity" in another words its saying there is only One God. But this represents "Tawhid" which is more than simply saying "God is One". It includes
*No person can take the Attributes of God."
*There is nothing like God."
*Only God is infallible."...etc
Muhammad urasool Allah doesn't just mean that Muhammad(SAW) is the Last Prophet, it also means the Last testimony the Qur'an was revealed to him and that his life is the way to understand the Qur'an.

This is according to the Aqidah of every muslim(Shia and Sunni).

Pantheism contradicts "La illaha illAllah" so even if they say the shahada but believe in pantheism then how can they be believers?

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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

Yes I agree with you totally -- BUT where is the disconnect with Ismailies .. Are they NOT muslims by affirming Shahada ?

I dont know where you get PANTHEISM etc ...

If you think Aga Khanis are not muslims despite affirming Shahada, you may be better off sharing the info with the world so that the Muslim Ummah should agree with you and take right steps in remedy.. .. else I can only suggest that GOD dislikes TOHMAT lagana ..., and if you are a scholar, you should perhaps proceed so as to bring reality and truth to the world in large ...

The Random Thread
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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

Peace Basit

i.e. their mission as a people rather than their belief system.

There are a variety of forms of Salah that is true, but bro did you know that all of them have a basic set of Fard. If those Faraid are not met then that is not Salah. E.g All of the valid forms of Salah include Sajud. Anyone claiming to perform Salah without Sajud is not performing Salah, rather has denounced Salah, even after paying lip service to it.

This is a very good translated piece of Surah Al-Baqarah, but I was talking about Salah not righteousness. About the emboldened part I cannot say either way, they seem to be so secretive.

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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

^If Ismailis believe in "Tawhid" then they are muslims but if they don't and think Hazar Imam is Allah(according to the information on wikipedia) then they are Mushrik.

I'm not a Scholar but I know the Aqeedah of muslims.

What food?
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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

ABSOLUTELY, if anyone worships other than ALLAH he is Mushrik and not a muslim ... There is no question about this ... AND, I know for fact that Ismailies believe in ONE ALLAH only .. their Imam is not ALLAH ...

Peace

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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

I dont know what you meant by "mission as people" where as I see them a peaceful nation, to make a difference and a world a better place through their Imam' s guidance and network .... I have worked very closely on Global International Projects ...

I was just talking to an Ismaili before posting this ... According to him, they ABSOLUTELY believe in ONE ALLAH and the SAJOOD is only to ALLAH ... There is no mixture of Sajuud and they Prostrate before ALLAH just like any Salaat ... He in fact, gave me a whole lecture about SAJOOD , where a person literally submits himself before ALLAH ... like a hakeer insaan in prayers etc ..

Also to mention to you ... Quran does not tell us that there is JUST one way of Salaat ... Salaat in general means call , pukarna , a call to ALLAH and Quran mentions many ways of Salaat ..

Just like Ismailies, there are many faiths within ISLAM that have different ways of performing the SALAAT ... BUT since you were talking about Ismailies their Salaat commence with Suraah Fatiha .. and they have several verses of Quran and their Sajood to ONLY ALLAH ...

I just wanted to share this info because there is a wrong perception in general about Ismailies and ppl generally dont know much and therefore they speculate ...

Please understand that NO One in the world can claim some one to be a non - muslim if they are reciting KALIMA / Shahada ... the Only requirement to be a MUSLIM is to say Shahada ..

The way people perform Namaz/ Salaat or the of times is all NOT the requirement to claim someone a non muslim ...

Anyway ... Salaam to all

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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

hareem01, thanks for the info bro.

Today On Chat
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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

Peace Basit

What I meant by 'mission as a people' is to answer your question 'what is meant by point of view' i.e. the Ismaili point of view regarding socio-political issues. The basic answer stemmed from the original statement of mine that the Ismaili website does NOT go to any attempt to speak about the fundamentals of the the Ismaili belief system. The material that is prevalent about the Ismailis is mostly contraversial. Now if Ismailis are so effective then how is it they are unable to effectively disseminate the creed they follow in any form of depth?

Don't kid yourself. You either are an Ismaili or you are faker about what they do and don't do. All the Ismailis I know never pray with us and information that I have from the Ismailis as friends of relatives is that they do not recognise our masajid and do not recognise our congregational prayers. Does your Ismaili friend attend your orthodox Islamic establishment?

You seem to have a habit of repeating yourself and ignoring what I have written. I will say so again. There are indeed many forms of salaat all include a set number of important actions (faraid) , if any of those are missed out then that is not Salat. What is the method that Ismailis pray Salaah, do tell!

Please elaborate and I will get this confirmed by our Ismaili contacts.

You are mistaken that the only requirement to be a Muslim is to say Shahada. It is to understand all of the requirements and agree with them. Under the nature of Tawhid, Raboobiyyah, Uloohiyah, Al-Asma WasSifat, Akhira i.e. the reality of Jahunnum and Jannah and the Day of Judgment, The Divine Decree, The finality of Prophethood and recognition of all true prophets, Belief in Angels and Belief in the Books. Each of these have a scope of belief. Though it is wrong to call any individual a kaafir, it is not wrong to denounce an ideology for being incorrect. That is all that is being done here with regards to the Ismaili belief system.

What is the Ismaili take on jihad? As I said ... we don't want to hear about what money they collect and where they spend it. That is not belief ... that is practice. Even the freemasons are a generous charitable organisation.

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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

First and foremost, there has to be an element of respect when you communicate ... what do you mean by "Don't kid yourself. You either are an Ismaili ..." I am relaying to you the facts, that you perhaps dont know and are just speculating rumors ...

If you already have your ismaili contact make sure he or she is educated enough to share info to you ... I say educated enough cos there are many other ppl for eg: sunnis who don't actualy know the details and they may share wrong info ... For instance Bin Laden or Al Qaida, they have their own interpertations that differ within the Muslim in large or even Sunnis ... Their interpretation of Jihad is different ...

I know that some of the Ismailies have their own place where they worship ... they have their own Namaz different from others .... BUT does that QUALIFY them NOT TO BE A MUSLIM ? or a lesser Muslim ? Does that mean that their communication/ SALAAT to GOD/ ALLAH is wrong ? who decides that ? You? me? a scholar ?

You need to study suffism where you will see that there are some Muslims and I am not talking about Ismailis but there are few who have their own way of performing Salaat/, they have their own places of worship ... for eg Khanaka and many more ...

My only point initially was to share that It's not you or me or anyone here to say someone to be a non muslim, if they are Saying Kalima ...

What you mentioned about being a muslim is your interpretation and I totally agree with you ... Nevertheless, THAT is NOT the requirement to be a Muslim confirmed by many scholars ... The Only requirement to be a muslim is to Say KALIMA / Shahada ...

If someone says Shahada / Kalima he or she is considered to be a MUSLIM ... regardless if he or she prays 5 times etc .... even the methods ... even within the Shiate Tradition and interpretation they have different ways and methods to practice their faith ...

Also, the belief system is there so that one can practice ..... AND, it's not that ONLY muslms are good or nearer to ALLAH ... or can only pray to ALLAH and rest of the ppl in the world other than muslims have a wrong way of praying .... Your CONDUCT is pivotal, your intereaction wih ALLAH and Humanity will be judged ... and all this in QURAN ...

I am out ! - peace and YES, if i am an Ismaili, believe me I WILL SAY --- I wish I was ....

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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

interesing documentary; not out yet i think but here’s a link to trailors

http://www.agakhanfilm.org/

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It is the duty of every Muslim to help remove some of the misconceptions non-Muslims have about Islam. By engaging in a dialogue with the non-Muslims, you will help lessen the level of anti-Muslim feelings in their hearts. These misconceptions prevent non-Muslims from seeing the beauty of Islam.

Name 3 things you'd like your spouse to improve
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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

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!!!now open: PaaN WaaN ki DukaaN... (a.k.a. PWD)
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Re: Ismaili religious beliefs

Peace again Basit

The facts that you have relayed so far are not the facts that we are looking for. Please provide an in-depth discourse on the belief system of the Ismaili ... if you cannot comply then you will need to explain why the links from Wikipedia are incorrect, seeing that they have not been contested thus far. With regards to respect well it is also respectful to answer questions aptly and to be honest with ones disposition i.e. religious affiliation.

Nice one! I have had a few associates in the past who profess to the Ismaili persuasion none of them are 'educated enough' ... I wonder why?

But you didn't answer the question regarding Jihad and by the way provide evidence of the conclusion you come to also please.

Actually if their prayer methods cannot be found in the Sunnah then Muhammad (SAW) has not performed their methods, which means it is an abomination of prayer if it is done differently. All of the acceptable prayer methods use some sort of link with the Sunnah. To pray incorrectly is just ignorance, but to believe that an invalid form of Salaah is valid, is incorrect.

The deviancy of others does not justify the deviancy of oneself.

That is true! However, if a Christian says he is monotheist or believes in One God, but insists that Jesus (AS) should be worshipped, then his claim to monotheism is plain lip service. Though I will out of respect not call him a mushrik, I will still indicate where his belief system is taking him astray. Which rather inconveniently I cannot do with Ismailis as effectively because getting to the core beliefs of this group is proving to be quite difficult, if Wikipedia is being denounced.

The Shahadah is the taking of a covenant. It is a promise that all of the tenets of Islam are going to be adhered to after it is said, it does not simply mean that one believes in the heart that there is One God and Muhammad is the Messenger, it means that this should be manifest in our actions also. To prove what I am saying please refer to the Qur'an ... Surah Al-Baqarah. The example is here with the Jews, but the logic is transmutable.

YUSUFALI:
002.091
When it is said to them, "Believe in what Allah Hath sent down, "they say, "We believe in what was sent down to us:" yet they reject all besides, even if it be Truth confirming what is with them. Say: "Why then have ye slain the prophets of Allah in times gone by, if ye did indeed believe?"

...

002.093
And remember We took your covenant and We raised above you (the towering height) of Mount (Sinai): (Saying): "Hold firmly to what We have given you, and hearken (to the Law)": They said:" We hear, and we disobey:" And they had to drink into their hearts (of the taint) of the calf because of their Faithlessness. Say: "Vile indeed are the behests of your Faith if ye have any faith!"

...

002.099
We have sent down to thee Manifest Signs (ayat); and none reject them but those who are perverse.

...

002.100
Is it not (the case) that every time they make a covenant, some party among them throw it aside?- Nay, Most of them are faithless.

...

As can be seen the people who have given lip service saying they are believers have themselves been refuted by Allah (SWT) in the Qur'an. Are we falling into the same trap as the people who came before us?

Agreed! I have emboldened the word considered. Man may consider them Muslim, but is it not more important what Allah (SWT) considers them as? If not praying 5 times a day is done through negligence then is it sin free? If however one believes that they do not have to pray 5 times a day to be Muslim is that not kufr?

If it is not only Muslims who are nearer to Allah (SWT) then how can we agree with the Qur'an that tells us the life of Muhammad (SAW) holds for us an excellent example. If Muslims actually do what Muhammad (SAW) did then there is no reason to doubt that Muslims are closer to Allah (SWT). The rest I agree with you!

Now please comply with the thread title ... What do Ismailis believe?

!!!now open: PaaN WaaN ki DukaaN... (a.k.a. PWD)