Re: hi all
Is one more important/influential?
How true are:
"Apples don't fall far from the tree"
or
"You can take the boy out of the pind but not the pind out of the boy"
Any takers??
--ladlaone
ahem, ahem,
Let me try,
I believe nature is more influential than nurturing as you know that there certain characteristics/qualities which are innate to certain creatures like water for fish, i.e., nobody teach them how to swim etc etc. Your last statement is more of a cliche than fact, it may applies to a lot of people but it doesn't necessarily effects everyone, hence, you can't use the same stick for everyone..
--Imranz
ladlaone:
I think you are comparing Apples with oranges here. I agree with Imranz you can't use the same yard stick to measure every one.
Some people can change and gain control over their nature basicaly I believe that human creature has one type of nature and it reacts to different aspects of life according to its nurturing during the ages of 5 to 15. thats when the child develops his /her's personality. later on its also known as his nature. As my noble friend said the fish don't need to be tought how to swim they just do, there are same things that apply to humans too. We enhance some and ignore some of our natural talents as we grow it all depends in which enviorment we are growing in.
I M iz D iron man.
la8erzzzzzzzzz.............
--iron man
wow, talk about intellecutals!
okay, here's my two cents' worth...
i agree with iron man for the most part.
i think nature and nurture are both important in a person's development. there are just too many characteristics involved for it to be just either nature or nurture. both play a vital role (in my opinion). we, as human beings, like any other living creature, have the innate will to survive, to prosper, etc. but each human being is very different from the next, this is due to both nature and nurture. even identical twins aren't always alike in their dislikes/likes. which could indicate that there may be something else which makes us, us besides just nature/nurture.
my point is (if you're not confused by now! that both are equally important.
--smile
I would like to quote an old saying here:
"tukham(seed) taseer, sohbat ka asar" so both nature and nurture are important in shaping the character of a person.
But beware "Asal say khata nahiN, kam-nasal say wafa nahiN"
--nuts
Nuts if you were not nuts I guess you will never say some thing like this much Hindu.
Nassal and kam nassal dont make a lesser human from one to the other. its the enviornoment that a person grows up makes the difference.
The reason you are this way is because you are a mohajir traped in Karachi who iz a Hindu wanna be. this zaat paat and nassal and kum nassal iz all Hindu *. We all are humans Tell me if a **** child iz wearing same clothes as a prince and you dont put a lable on the childs fore head will you be able to tell that this child is kum nassal?
I can bet if you keep your mouth shut no one will be able to tell what kind of complex you are living your life in. Also if you were born in a different house hold your thoughts and goals would have been totally different.
Nuts first of all its not your fault if you like to hang below now thats your nature and nurture cant change that. Because God made you like that. so keep hanging tight Nuts and dont let anyone kick you it hurts real bad.
I M iz D iron man.
la8erzzzzzzzzzzzz..........
--iron man
My mom always says panch unleeaa baraaber hothain naheen.
If genetics (nature) was all there is, how do you explain the differences in looks and personality that exist between brothers and sisters raised in the same home.
I think nature and nurture both effect the child that is created.
--kashmirigirl
In my mail I said "both nature and nurture are important in shaping the character of a person" This is the actually my opinion on this topic. Environment has a lot of influence one's personality, like Iqbal said:
Wo bach-cha-e-shaheen jo pala ho kurghussoN(=vultures) maiN
Wo kia janay kia hay rah-o-rasm-e-shahbazi
But it can not change the nature altogether. A diamond cut by an expert is a treasure but a piece of coal could never have a comparable value no matter how many expert work on it, they are nearly similar but a subtle difference has given one of them an eternal life in high, beautiful and protected places and the other is destined to burn in "its own fire" (= iron man's hatred for muhajirs) and become a naught in no time.
So, my friends I warned you that you can not get apples from cactus no matter if it grows in desert or in your drawing room. A snake will always bite (=iron man will always speak filthy language) no matter how friendly environment it is in (=iron man in a forum of decent people). If our pakistani people were more careful we would have never lost our east wing (Bengal). General Askander Mirza was great grand son of Mir Jaffer - The traitor of Bengal. He first imposed Martial law eradicating the democracy and we are still suffering the consequences.
There are a number of body and mental diseases known to be transferred by inheritance and there may be a lot still unknown. And how many spiritual diseases are transferred we will never know. Genetical memory is an amazing discovery of science, it is believed that gene has record of all events that have happened to it since first life form was created. You know how race horses are selected and how much they cost even before any race training just because of their ancestory. I don't mean to compare "ashraf-ul-makhlooq" with horses but we have a lot of things common (I don't believe in Darwin's theory, but when I read Iron man, well….).
Even two brothers or sisters may be different (As KG has pointed out) or ba kol shair:
Ek hi ghar kay rehnay waloN maiN
Ek say doosra nahiN milta
But normally two brothers also share the same environment and brought up and still they are different. Somebody talked about astrology in some other threads, but two babies born at same time may have different life. I think there are in-numerous variable to be consider, but I think most important of them is nature. You will find old saying to this meaning in all parts of world. One in urdu I quoted and it was not just my opinion it was the collective wisdom of many many generations.(but Iron Man doesn't know what is collective wisdom or wisdom for that matter).
But this is my opinion, everybody has every right to differ with it and free to give reasons and precedences against it and free to try change my opinion. But, no body and I repeat no body is allowed to use abusive language against me, my community, my ethnic group, my language or against my city. All decent people from noble families already knows this but SOME *******S FROM SLUMS don't know it and they won't get it into their minds except through a hole.
Iron Man:
I have told you before that I can not talk to you because my parents didn't teach me the language you speak. But they do tell me how to teach a lesson to people with a background like you.
--nuts
KG wrote:
"
If genetics (nature) was all there is, how do you explain the differences in looks and personality that exist between brothers and sisters
"
Dear KG the genetics( or nature )doesn't mean the immediate family or mother and father. It goes far beyond it, heard somebody resembling with his/her great grandfather/mother, or great, great...
Remember the Mendal's (spelling?) experiments.
--nuts
Nuts I am sorry I think You are hurt by my posting it waz a joke just forget it.
I feel bad for you I wish there was anything that I could do for you. I don't hate muhajir's its the fnatics that I don't like and please tell some one to read your postings for you Because they can tell you whats wrong with you. You sound like a extreamist and thats not good for yor health. Especially when you will come accross a person like me who will tell it right on your face what you really are.(Nuts)..
You said....
" But it can not change the nature altogether. A diamond cut by an expert is a treasure but a piece of coal could never have a comparable value no matter how many expert work on it, they are nearly similar but a subtle difference has given one of them an eternal life in high, beautiful and protected places and the other is destined to burn in "its own fire" (= iron man's hatred for muhajirs) and become naught in no time...."
If I am not getting it wrong you are telling us that a Daimond is the person who is not a muhajir because he was born in Pakistan in a normal family and coal iz a muhajir no matter what you do they can never change? Or you mean it the other way around?
you said..
" So, my friends I warned you that you can not get apples from cactus no matter if it grows in desert or in your drawing room. A snake will always bite (=iron man will always speak filthy language) no matter how friendly environment it is in (=iron man in a forum of decent people). If our pakistani people were more careful we would have never lost our east wing (Bengal)."
Please read your self again and tell me how did I abused you Did I forced you to have this nick "NUTS" Now if I call you nuts why are you calling it filthy language?..
and why dont you look around you and ask the people in this or any other forum how many friends you have? Trust me face the reality and bite the bullet No one likes you. The reason I am in the forum of decent people iz that I know how to be where I am. I wont bring Politics in every thing thats being said. Now tell us How you fit Bengal and the Mir jaffer thing in this thread? only some one has to be Nuts to do that.
You know I can just keep going on and on but I think you not worth it so get a life and say Hi to usama and other muhajir friends too.
I M iz D iron man.
la8erzzzzzzzz.........
--iron man
Nuts jee
My bad!!!
Genetics give you your looks.
But, what about how you wear your hair, the style of clothing you wear or also how you carry yourself and present your self. That is effected by the environment.
--kashmirigirl
There are some basic factors, i.e temprament, cognition etc which vary between individuals, mediated through genetics.
Life experiences of the organism with a specific set of predetermined (genetically determined) parameters form the final out come.
--Quark
Nuts
"General Askander Mirza was great grand son of Mir Jaffer - The traitor of Bengal."
This is something new for me. Can I get some more details on this????
--UnLimited
KG:
yes, environment has a vital role in making the personality. Everybody is influenced by his/her environment. But there are few things (basic nature) that can not be changed, like a mother will always love his child, a dog will always be loyal to his master, vultures will always eat corpses, pigs will always eat **** even if clean food is available, and the list continues.
UnLimited:
I read it in Dawn Magazine few months back, I will tell you the date if i could find it. It was about the son of Askandar Mirza who was in UK then and was writing a book to justify the act of treachery by his great great grand father Mir Jaffer.
--nuts
nuts
thanks
--UnLimited
I think there are three major factors involved,
Genetics - some people are just born stubborn or hyer-active or loudmouth etc etc...
khandaan- this depends on family and background, This is why parents look for khandaan when trying to find potential mates for their children. Education and money can only bring so much refinement, - Refinement
or pedigree is based on precedence, and precdence is based on culture and traditions of a family. The values that get passed from generation to generation.
upbringing: This is very important, because if the parents ignore their children ie typical 2 income desi couple in the US, the children are bound to fall far from the tree.
Education: Education brings refinement, - but edcucation without a good background is what we call "educated vagabond". You find plenty of them in the US. People who excel in their professions, but behave like idiots, -
Another place to look for this is ABCD gals -
who are first generation educated girls, they usually go ballistic with Western values.
--jack handy
I think the only way to solve this one is to clone a person and place the two people in different environments and see what happens.
The only problem is that cloning opens up a whole new can of worms. I still don't know if I'm for it or not. I'm all for technology trying to prevent/cure diseases, avoid birth defects but cloning is still seems so unnatural.
--ladlaone
this is not mistake. This is crime. 