Have they found WMD yet? - Part 2 (MERGED)

Exposed: Blair, Iraq and the great deception](http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/politics/story.jsp?story=416531)

Tony Blair was charged with deliberately misleading the public over Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction yesterday as two former cabinet ministers revealed that MI6 believed Saddam Hussein’s arsenal posed no immediate threat.

In an extraordinary public hearing at Westminster, Clare Short and Robin Cook told MPs that intelligence chiefs had concluded that the risk of Saddam using chemical or biological weapons was not high.

Ms Short, the former secretary of state for international development, said Mr Blair was guilty of “honourable deception” and claimed he used "a series of half-truths, exaggerations, reassurances that were not the case to get us into conflict by the spring.

“I believe that the Prime Minister must have concluded that it was honourable and desirable to back the US in going for military action in Iraq and therefore it was honourable for him to persuade us through various ruses and ways to get us there - so for him I think it was an honourable deception,” said Ms Short.

Mr Cook, the former foreign secretary, accused ministers of “not presenting the whole picture” and presenting selective evidence to back the case for war.

Both former ministers said Mr Blair exaggerated the threat posed by Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction, and condemned the Government’s dossier on Saddam’s arsenal as “shoddy” and “thin”.

They spoke out at the start of the all-party Commons Foreign Affairs Committee’s inquiry into Mr Blair’s handling of the run-up to war.

Their testimony, based on detailed knowledge of intelligence reports from Iraq and personal briefings with senior figures from the Secret Intelligence Service, MI6, undermined repeated claims made by Mr Blair and other senior ministers that Saddam represented an imminent threat to the Middle East and world.

Mr Cook told MPs that in his briefing with the chairman of the Joint Intelligence Committee: “I heard nothing to contradict anything I said in my resignation statement that Iraq does not have weapons of mass destruction in the understood sense of the term.”

Mr Cook, who saw all intelligence reports on Iraq between 1997 and 2001, said he did not believe that Saddam had succeeded in building biological weapons. He revealed that concerns about Iraq had eased to such an extent in the late 1990s that Britain considered “closing the files” on Saddam’s nuclear and long-range missile programmes.

Ms Short, who saw raw intelligence reports and was briefed repeatedly by MI6 and the Defence Intelligence Staff before the war, said: “There is a risk, but the risk of use is not high, was probably the tone.”

She insisted that she had never heard Mr Blair’s now infamous claim that Iraq could deploy chemical or biological weapons “within 45 minutes” in any of her intelligence reports.

Both former ministers bitterly attacked the Government’s dossiers on Iraq’s weapons. Mr Cook said of the first dossier: "I was taken aback at how thin the dossier was. There was a striking absence of any recent and alarming firm intelligence. The great majority was derivative.

"The plain fact is that a lot of the intelligence in the dossier turned out to be wrong.

“Stripped down, there was very little in that document that presented new alarming evidence of an imminent threat.”

He said the second dossier - criticised as “dodgy” after it was revealed to include material from a PhD thesis culled from the internet - had been a “glorious and spectacular own goal”, while Ms Short said it was a “shameful piece of work”.

Mr Cook said: “There was a selection of evidence to support a conclusion, rather than a conclusion that arose from a full consideration of the evidence.”

Ms Short added: “This phrase ‘weapons of mass destruction’. When that is used, people think of bombs full of chemical and biological weapons waiting to rain out of the skies. They don’t think of scientists in laboratories doing experiments … That is where the falsity lies. Yes, he [Saddam] was dedicated to scientists carrying out chemical or biological work, but the suggestion to the public was it was all weaponised and a dangerous threat.”

Mr Cook said: “Iraq was an appallingly difficult intelligence target to break. There was very little human intelligence on the ground and no hope of putting in a Western intelligence agent.” But he warned: “The absence of intelligence is a bloody thin ground on which to go to war.”

Ms Short used her hour-long appearance to attack Mr Blair’s style of government, accusing a cabal of unelected advisers of sidelining the Cabinet and the Foreign Office in the approach to war.

She said: “Things were not decided properly; no records, no papers; in the Prime Minister’s study - all informal with a small group of in people.”

Downing Street declined to respond to the claims.

Michael Ancram, the shadow Foreign Secretary, said: “This reinforces our call for an independent judicial inquiry.”

Ms Short, the former secretary of state for international development, said Mr Blair was guilty of "honourable deception" and claimed he used "a series of half-truths, exaggerations, reassurances that were not the case to get us into conflict by the spring.

Hmmm..."honourable deception", a nice phrase that will probably haunt Blair (and Bush) for months to come. :)

To anyone that hasn’t devoted their full energies to following every detail of this debate, this article summarizes it well with every major detail, some that you may have forgotten or not known before. It is a pretty long read, but it is a good review.

THE SELLING OF THE IRAQ WAR.
The First Casualty
](http://tnr.com/doc.mhtml?i=20030630&s=ackermanjudis063003)

The United States may still find chemical and biological weapons in Iraq. But the damage is already done. The Bush administration grossly exaggerated Iraq’s nuclear program and its ties to Al Qaeda. And, in so doing, it misled the American people about the most important decision a government can make. A special investigation into the selling of the war.

I feel that they will magically find WMDs any time now. They are in much pressure to do so, and with the capture of Mahmud al-Tikriti it will give them the oppurtunity to brag about their great interrogation skills.

^ they recently found "secret documents" in an abondoned hall, lets see what comes out of the bag.

Campbell to face WMD inquiry after all, The Guardian, 23 June 2003

Alastair Campbell will now appear before a Commons committee investigating claims that the public was misled in the run-up to the war on Iraq, Downing Street announced today.

The appearance of Whitehall’s chief spin doctor - Tony Blair’s director of communications and strategy - at the foreign affairs select committee inquiry marks a u-turn by Downing Street.

It rejected an initial approach, saying such a move would break with precedent, and turned down a second request from the committee only on Friday.

It looks like the regime in Britain is coming apart, and the pointing of fingers has begun over the WMD fiasco…

Straw says dossier was ‘embarrassing’](BBC NEWS | Politics | Straw says dossier was 'embarrassing')

**Nuke component unearthed in Baghdad back yard

(CNN) – The CIA has in its hands the critical parts of a key piece of Iraqi nuclear technology – parts needed to develop a bomb program – that were dug up in a back yard in Baghdad, CNN has learned. **

^ WoW!!! why am I not surprised, I thought saddy moved every thing to NK..... LOL....

Must be a mistake, Saddams an honest and stand-up kind of guy, he wouldn't hide this from the U.N.

Yes, and the source of this information is none other than Mahdi Obeidi - according to your CNN article, an Iraqi scientist “who has been taken out of Iraq with the help of the U.S. government.” Wonder what else he was offered alongwith the coveted green card, in order to spew his little lies.

Nadia, it's been dug up, you believe it was placed there by the U.S.?

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by underthedome: *
**Nadia, it's been dug up, you believe it was placed there by the U.S.?
[/QUOTE]
*

UTD, According to the CNN article, "The parts were unearthed by Iraqi scientist Mahdi Obeidi who had hidden them under a rose bush in his garden 12 years ago..."

At any rate. If it is accurate and everything, then i look forward to an independent and positive assessment of this from the UN inspections team - if/when they are allowed to re-enter the country. International legitimacy would go a long way perhaps.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by underthedome: *
Nadia, it's been dug up, you believe it was placed there by the U.S.?
[/QUOTE]

Naaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!! US!!!!! Naaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!! Saddy put it there I saw it..

Time will tell.

Nadia: That was the whole point of trying to get Iraqi scientists and their families safely out of Iraq for interviews. Get them out and make them safe so they’d tell us where things were buried. Here are some revealing parts of the story.

** "Obeidi said he felt unsafe in Iraq after the U.S.-led invasion and that he was getting pressure from different corners of the country.

He also said other Iraqi scientists were watching to see if he was safe after he cooperated with the U.S. government.

Now that he and his family are safely out of Iraq, Obeidi said he believes other scientists would come forward with other components of Iraq’s weapons program. **


"David Kay, who led three U.N. arms inspection missions in Iraq in 1991-92 and now heads the CIA’s search for unconventional weapons, started work two days ago in Baghdad. CNN spoke to him about the case over a secure teleconferencing line.

“It begins to tell us how huge our job is,” Kay said. "Remember, his material was buried in a barrel behind his house in a rose garden.

**“There’s no way that that would have been discovered by normal international inspections. I couldn’t have done it. My successors couldn’t have done it.” **

Kay said he had mixed emotions when he saw the centrifuge components: “It was a realization that I hadn’t gotten all the parts [of Iraq’s nuclear program]. So there was a moment of regret, but there was also an exhilaration that now maybe we have a chance to take this to the very bottom.”


**“Obeidi also said he was not the only scientist ordered to hide that type of equipment.” **


"Experts said the documents and pieces Obeidi gave the United States were the critical information and parts to restart a nuclear weapons program, and would have saved Saddam’s regime several years and as much as hundreds of millions of dollars for research. "

:rotfl: OMG! When are these people going to learn to finish the story before they release it to the media?!

Y’see, dual use technologies were a big sticking point back in the day.. they could be used for cleaning swimming pools, purifying blood, etc.. or ominous drum beat they could be used to make WMD! :eek:

Now it seems they can be used as evidence of a nuclear program. Just have to make enough stops by pool shacks and blood banks, etc to gather the pieces…

I don’t think this Iraqi scientist who was undeniably involved in Saddam’s nuclear program which did undeniably exist at one time, buried his documentation and centrifuge so that he could build and clean his swimming pool when inspectors left.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by underthedome: *
Time will tell.
[/QUOTE]
:D

Spring 2002, State Dept INR (their intell branch):
“The reports of Iraqi attempts at obtaining nuclear fuels from Africa are flatly false.” [paraphrase, original still classified]

Summer 2003, State Dept INR:
“There is no reliable evidence showing that the two vehicles thought to be biological labs actually are such; in fact, most hints that they indeed are not.” [paraphrase, original still classified]

Agency Disputes View of Trailers as Labs](Yahoo News: Latest and Breaking News, Headlines, Live Updates, and More)