Well I did mention why too & then I also mentioned I tried to reach out to NAK. Its you who is trying to create drama from the very start but unfortunately thats not happening for you. Keep trying.
I can do that
@bourjois we don't know what will happen in the hereafter for sure as G-d is the final judge and we can't decide for Him however what you can do is report your father to authorities and run away from home to some shelter, warn everybody about the predator this man is to protect society.
Does she have any older cousins or relatives whom she can tell about her ordeal?
Any trusted elders?
I doubt the molvi can do anything as it will involved the dad and he will deny it
There's nothing Islamic that can be done as there is no fear of God and I doubt will any Islamic ruling will.work as this is inhumane and had got nothing to do with religion
I recall stoning but there has to be evidence and witnesses and sanity ( mentally) and only in Islamic country
since he is blaming jinns etc on her as per your post , try alim or molvi visiting him or Quran recitation around him to see if he is normal
If he ever got caught red handed, he might deny and blame on the jinns etc
See if can move out to some trusted cousins , relatives or elders if they believe in her
Last resort will be seek shelter from the NGO or those revelent women's groups
The simple answer is there is no specific ruling from Fiqha or Ijtihaad on child molestation in general, especially not amongst family members to the best of my knowledge. There is definitely no such reference or ruling in the Quran or Ahadees. In Islam, there is lot of respect and trust put in the 'Mehram', and it appears if someone is a Mehram, he or she is not capable of having sexual intentions towards a fellow Mehram. Of course this is not correct but this is what it is. If you are a firm follower of religion, you need to accept the things as they are.
Hope this helps.
Nav
Bourjois,
The punishment for fornication (in the link below) with a mahram is death. However, I don’t see a hadith reference for it and I suspect that molestation won’t be treated at the same level as fornication. You can try to search the story/reference that is mentioned below.
https://www.islamweb.net/emainpage/i…twaId&Id=82186
Apart from the above link, I have come across what is referred to as Tazir. Tazir is basically punishment that is administered by the qadhi or state for crimes that don’t have a specified punishment in the hadith and Quran and for crimes that are harder to prove (through evidence and witnesses). The Tazir punishment can include serving a prison term, flogging, paying a fine, and seizure of property. All 4 of the mazhabs have left the the punishment of death to the discretion of the state, qadhi, etc.
I tried searching on youtube and came across one video were the scholar mentioned tazir and he said something along the lines that the tazir can also be given on top of or in addition to the already prescribed punishments. That’s what led me to look up Tazir punishment next. And if I had to guess…and it’s only a guess on my part because my knowledge is severely limited and I only did a cursory search online…but I suspect that the issue of molestation will be treated with a Tazir punishment. And I don’t know how one would go about bringing this to the attention of an Islamic authority.
In the meantime, let’s try to figure out what the girl can do to protect herself. If she’s not currently employed, is there any way that she can find employment and move out? It will reduce the dependency on her parents. That may be a starting place. In terms of marriage, is there any trustworthy member at all within her family that can help her with not only finding a rishta but also facilitating the process to completion for her? The girl has every right to seek justice for the abuse that she has suffered, but the process for seeking justice (in general ) tends be complex and long drawn and there are many consequences to consider. And in this quest, I don’t think she should ignore the more immediate and more pressing needs for her well-being.
Thank for your detailed reply, as always useful, as ever insightful.
When I talk about Islam not recognising potential for sexual feelings amongst mehrams, I am addressing inter-generational mehrams, the ‘father and mother figures’, like father, mother, uncle, aunts etc. Of course Islam advises beds of male and female siblings be segregated after a certain age, but it does not specifically mention incest nor its punishment. Also, there is no prohibition for female siblings to sleep on same bed and same goes for male siblings. To me it appears Islam recognises potential for sexual feelings between male and female siblings after a certain age but not necessarily between siblings of same gender. However there is no specific mention of any such possibility between father and daughter neither does it say anything about any punishment.
The Bukhari/Muslim Hadees you referenced (which I have read before) talks about fornication, and it specifically mentions a non-mehram person, not a mehram, so i believe my point stays valid.
I agree Tazir is the right channel, but Tazir is a state punishment based on the law of state, which of course is a different authority, and cannot be called an Islamic ruling or punishment for a certain crime. The OP is fully entitled and even encouraged to to seek help from the state, but asking for a specific punishment from a religious point of view like for sexual crimes like Zana, Zana-bil-jabar or Alliwat will not be found as there is none.
Hope this helps
Nav
I'm no Islamic scholar or anything...but when it comes to fornication don't you need like 4 witnesses to prove fornication? And then if 4 witnesses prove this...the fornicators get stoned...
And in the Quran it clearly states that for guys a mahram is haram for you. You shouldn't even go near it.
So even though this is not fornication, but more molestation..., but he's essentially committing a double sin, I would assume the same punishment or a even greater punishment applies...getting stoned..or getting stoned to death.
This whole discussion is so gross
This is an absurd statement. Why would you be incapable of having these intentions? Your intentions to have sexual relationship with a mehram or non-mehram are from Shaitaan. Any sexual intercourse (fornication, zina) outside the boundary of marriage is illegal in Islam. It is clearly defined in Hadith and Quran without any distinction of whether a mehram is involved or not.
@redvelvet some important points, thank you.
That?s heartbreaking.
Is it pos for you to collect/keep DNA evidence, and go to police and register a case?
not allow in islam
Well she has started to beat her parents & in response getting beaten up even more by his brothers. By hurting her parents obviously she is committing a sin but her situation is quite difficult too. She cant go outside, she has no idea what road they live on, whats happening outside the world, she got no money, no access, cant do anything on her own, not allowed to go outside at all, no support, no defense system plus the abuse she has been getting this whole time, no wonder she is doing what she is doing right now. They aren't marrying her either, they aren't looking but say they are just to shut her up. No one believes her that what she is saying is even true not even her mother & when she directly questioned her father, he made it a spiritual thing that she is possessed with something ( they contacted a peer too & that's another level of mental torture for her) hence she is talking such things just so the father gets away with it & the sad part is whole family believes him. What she has done is that she doesn't come out of her room when father is around, she has isolated herself. She is stuck & she is stuck sooo badd : (
@bourjois This poor girl’s ordeal is horrible. She is able to get the information about her condition and situation out right? Else how would you know what to post here?
Here is my advice, since she is in Pakistan, have her or have someone else she can trust, contact Ansar Burney Trust. Info below:
https://ansarburney.org/what-we-do/
+92 21 32623382
[email protected]
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