Let me give you a little insight, Pakistan does not produce anything that is not available on the international market. But what Pak has is the knowledge which is hard to control even by US, don't forget Wen Ho Lee case. The actual physical material came from other sources not pak. That is what IAEA is here to put a lid on so it don't get out. To tell us not to produce high tech machinery and sell it to ever Tom Dick and Harry. That would be most hilarious cause we ourself are importers not exporters.... If you are spreading another rumor that Pak will hand over its nukes to IAEA then you are not the first! and why now why not when it was most convinent to rid Pak of its WMD.
Musharrafs loyalty to the US is exemplery.
It is not just knowledge buddy. We got a lot from outside through the ingenuity of people like AQK who were more useful because they knew where to get what.
When we needed Tritium for boosted nukes, China helped us with the Khusab facility. Now China is joining the NSG (Nuclear Suppliers Group) which means, that route is shut in the future.
Now, I have never said that we will "hand over" our nukes to America. So don't ever try again to put words in my mouth.
I'm saying that we are giving the IAEA one foot in the door and that's all they need. Do you thinks its a coincidence that from US to Europe everyone is talking about Pakistan proliferation by coincidence? This is all driven by leaks from US and other Western governments. They are slowly chipping away at our sovereignty.
First we said that our nukes are 100% secure. Then they forced us to admit side leakage by "rogue" scientists. Now we are going to dock the biggest name and some related people. If God forbid Gen.Musahrraf goes, then see what happens. The propaganda will expand 100%. We can make bravado talk that we will nuke you etc. But our leadership is always interested in self preservation. That is the story of our nation. Great people, bad leaders.
If you want to be in denial, please continue to be in it. Now please don't put words in my mouth.
Dawn says Abdul Qadeer has admitted to the allegations. What Dawn doesn't tell us that the sicentists were given this free hand by the government to do as they please as long as they gave Pakistan the bomb.
Very true.
As I have said some people here are only making allegations based on speculatory news articles (do you notice how they keep posting news items quoting “unconfirmed” or unnamed sources?), and based largely on their own political biases. These people made similar allegations on these basis in 2003, 2002 and 2001, and even going back to 1988 (that I listed previously) only to be proven largely wrong. And as you mentioned these same people also claimed that Pak nukes were in Chinese custody, only to be proven wrong again.
I bet these people don’t even know that Pakistan has a member of the IAEA since 1957, for which we have certain international obligations, or that the IAEA has visited Pakistan on previous occasions, like in 1999 IAEA DG makes 5-day visit to Pakistan 
But notice how these same people cannot seem to address the treachery of Libya (and Iran) towards Pakistan, for which there is ample and clear admission from those states, yet can castigate those in Pakistan?
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Zakk: *
To be fair guys..no evidence has suggested that Musharraf even remotely authorised any Nuke exchange. He's a victim of previous governments actions.
[/QUOTE]
Well, Qaddafi's son has been visiting Pakistan, even during Musharraf's regime...
Qaddafi's son calls on Musharraf
Sunday December 01, 2002 (1343 PST)
RAWALPINDI, Nov30- Saif-ul-Islam Qaddafi, Chairman Charity International Foundation and son of Mr. Qadafi meets President General Pervez Musharraf in Rawalpindi
ISLAMABAD: Seiful Islam Qaddafi, head of the Qaddafi International Foundation for charity associations (QJF), who is currently on a visit to Pakistan in connection with the activities of the Foundation called on President Gen. Pervez Musharraf on Saturday and delivered a good will message from Colonel Muammar Qaddafi, the leader of the Libyan Revolution.
While welcoming the distinguished visitor from Libya, the President reciprocated the warn greetings of the Libyan leader and expressed the hope that it will be possible for Colonel Qaddafi to pay an early visit to Pakistan.
The President briefed him on the situation obtaining in IHK and observed that, Muslim countries like Libya could play a constructive role in urging India to respond positively to Pakistan's offers for a dialogue to resolve the dispute.
The President and the visiting dignitary agreed on the need to further strengthen bilateral relations and for forging greater unity among the Muslim Ummah with the OIC playing a leading role in forcefully supporting all Muslim causes including the Kashmir dispute.
Saiful Islam last visited Pakistan in December 2001 as special envoy of his father Col. Muammar Qaddafi with a message for President General Pervez Musharraf.
Listen Malik,
IAEA chief visiting Pakistan is the same as an IAEA inspection team visiting. Right…
As a Pakistani I’m more interested in the fact that our scientists are being scapegoated for something that is obviously involving other people. I want to know who asked AQK to work with Libya and Iran. Is it a coincidence that Gen.Beg called for a tie up with Iran at the same time these alleged deals occurred? I don’t think so.
Why is it that every time, our Generals sell out all the people to save their own butts
AQK can send PAF planes to Libya and our leaders had no idea. Thay are all shocked by his “treachery”
well, i have friends who work in organizations producing these kind of weapons in pakistan...and according to them, they have to provide the list of people that they will meet...in other words their movements are watched...and the pro musharraf guys want us to believe the Qadeer proliferated on his own? the acceptance of qadeer has one of the two possibilities only...
1) either pakistan's command and control isnt fool proof...any one can transfer what ever technology they have to any one in the world...the world's biggest fear
2) or the army, was involved in the proliferation itself being the most powerful organization which has been ruling pakistan virtually through its past 56 years...
Zaavia,
Spot on.
Think of it this way. If AQK could have done all this by himself, then Pakistan govt is openly admitting that our nuclear facilities are not protected.
It's all nonsense of course. Musharraf is just looking out for his own interests and that of his army buddies. Who cares if a few scientists are sacrificed at that altar of self interest.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Khilaari: *
It's all nonsense of course. Musharraf is just looking out for his own interests and that of his army buddies. Who cares if a few scientists are sacrificed at that altar of self interest.
[/QUOTE]
although during the past coupl of years, qaddafi's son is visiting pakistan, and even musharraf visited libya a few months ago...
http://www.iht.com/articles/127562.html
**
The Pakistani connection
**
NYT Monday, February 2, 2004
General Pervez Musharraf, Pakistan’s military ruler, has a history of strong declarations followed by weak and contradictory actions. Washington cannot settle for a repetition of this pattern in the Pakistani investigation into whether its nuclear scientists passed bomb technology to North Korea, Iran and Libya. All the links in this reckless supply chain - commercial, military or political - must be uncovered and severed.
**
Pakistan now appears to be one of the world’s leading suppliers of illicit nuclear technology.
**
In 2002, American satellites detected a Pakistani plane picking up missile components in North Korea, apparently as part of a barter deal for nuclear weapons technology. Last November, Iran told nuclear inspectors that its uranium enrichment programs had gotten crucial help from people in various nations who were probably linked to Pakistanis.
And in recent weeks, Libya has indicated that its nuclear programs benefited from intermediaries in Dubai who may have been working with Pakistanis.
The picture now emerging points to an intricate underground network of traders in nuclear contraband. Filling in all the details depends on thoroughly questioning all those likely to have been involved and aggressively following up the leads provided by the new Iranian and Libyan disclosures.
**
It is not yet clear that Musharraf is willing to do this. He has backed off from insisting that Pakistan was never involved in nuclear technology exports. He now claims that whatever problems existed came from rogue scientists in pursuit of financial gain.**
The investigation he began under American pressure has so far centered on close associates of Abdul Qadeer Khan, the scientist who helped Pakistan illicitly obtain its own nuclear weapons secrets in the 1970’s. **Pakistani investigators must also probe whatever role senior military and political leaders may have played.
**
Such a wide-ranging investigation will not be easy for Musharraf to undertake. The military high command is his most important power base. He is currently under attack from several directions and barely escaped two recent assassination attempts. Even so, Washington must insist that he not flinch from his responsibility to see that the nuclear technology pipeline from Pakistan is finally closed down. The world cannot afford a repetition of what seems to have happened in Iran, Libya and North Korea.
(entire stroy from LA Times)
Pakistani Scientist Admits to Selling Secrets
Military officials say Abdul Qadeer Khan signed a confession detailing technology transfer to Iran, Libya and North Korea.
By Mubashir Zaidi, Special to The Times
ISLAMABAD, Pakistan — The father of Pakistan’s nuclear bomb, Abdul Qadeer Khan, has admitted providing nuclear secrets to Iran, Libya and North Korea, senior Pakistani military officials said Sunday.
In a background briefing to Pakistani journalists, officials said they had obtained a 12-page confession from Khan, who had led Pakistan’s nuclear program since the 1970s and helped it become the first Muslim nation to possess nuclear weapons. They said that although Khan received money in exchange for the secrets, his main motivation in spreading the technology was to help other Islamic nations become nuclear powers.
Iran and Libya are Muslim nations, but North Korea is not. Officials said Khan, by spreading nuclear technology to other Muslim states, hoped to relieve Western pressure on Pakistan to scrap its nuclear program.
On Saturday, the Pakistani government fired Khan from his job as a top-level advisor. It was unclear Sunday whether Khan would be put on trial. Officials said Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf would address the nation in the next few days to spell out the details of the findings and announce what action, if any, would be taken against Khan. His home was under military guard over the weekend, and family friends said he was under house arrest.
Pakistan’s Inter-Services Intelligence agency began investigating Khan and other nuclear scientists in December after inspectors from the International Atomic Energy Agency found evidence of Pakistani involvement in Iran’s nuclear program.
Although Pakistan’s nuclear program has long been under military control, the officials who briefed journalists said the military had been unaware of Khan’s proliferation activities.
The officials said other scientists, including Mohammed Farooq, helped Khan spread nuclear secrets and that the technology was transmitted between 1991 and 1997.
“We have also traced the entire route of this proliferation and Dr. Khan’s connections with the nuclear black marketeers,” one official said.
Officials said Khan provided other nations not only with nuclear technology but with equipment. The officials said a Sri Lankan known by the name Farooq was the main contact between Khan and black marketeers.
Pakistan followed neighboring India with its first nuclear weapons tests in 1998. Both countries are also building and testing a series of short- and medium-range missiles capable of carrying nuclear warheads.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by 5Abi: *
Although Pakistan's nuclear program has long been under military control, the officials who briefed journalists said the military had been unaware of Khan's proliferation activities.
[/QUOTE]
Yea rite! Choochay bachay hein ye military walay... didn't know whats going on. Shabaash!
Look maa, no military involvement… 
Is this ever going to stop getting worse by the day! How naive is statements such as above. As it is everyone was saying nuclear cannot be trustd with Pakistan. Now this kind of statement is offering proof. AQK has really really done great harm to his country. And the assimilation of money clearly proves his intentions were totally selfish.
And if someone is again going to say the 2Billion is for doing deals for the country, how do you explain the villa and the million dollar wedding and the 400K dollar tent? Those were to serve the country also?
All AQK has done is served up his own country in a plate to dishonor.
And to think all these years he has been making statements like “I can’t remember ever paying for lunch”…we thought it was because they wouldn’t let him pay. Won’t be surprised if it os revealed tomorrow that he snuck out from the restaurant!
TomSawyer bhai jaan... Instead of badal badal the nick, why don't you get guidance from the Admin so they don't make miserable all your new nicks... kiya khayal hai?
I mean registering new email addresses and then a new GS nick and then going thru the whole nine yards again and again, just so you can post junk about Pakistan... its gets repetitive and tiring.
:rotfl: :rotfl: Shabbash AQ Khan.
**Musharraf Named in Nuclear Probe
Senior Pakistani Army Officers Were Aware of Technology Transfers, Scientist Says **
By John Lancaster and Kamran Khan
Washington Post Foreign Service
Tuesday, February 3, 2004; Page A13
ISLAMABAD, Pakistan, Feb. 2 – **Pakistan’s top nuclear scientist, Abdul Qadeer Khan, has told investigators that he helped North Korea design and equip facilities for making weapons-grade uranium with the knowledge of senior military commanders, including Gen. Pervez Musharraf, Pakistan’s president, according to a friend of Khan’s and a senior Pakistani investigator.
Khan also has told investigators that Gen. Mirza Aslam Beg, the Pakistani army chief of staff from 1988 to 1991, was aware of assistance Khan was providing to Iran’s nuclear program and that two other army chiefs, in addition to Musharraf, knew and approved of his efforts on behalf of North Korea, the same individuals said Monday.
Khan’s assertions of high-level army involvement came in the course of a two-month probe into allegations that he and other Pakistani nuclear scientists made millions of dollars from the sale of equipment and expertise to Iran, Libya and North Korea.
They contradict repeated contentions by Musharraf and other senior officials that Khan and at least one other scientist, Mohammed Farooq, acted out of greed and in violation of long-standing government policy that bars the export of nuclear weapons technology to any foreign country.
In conversations with investigators, Khan urged them to question the former army commanders and Musharraf, asserting that “no debriefing is complete unless you bring every one of them here and debrief us together,” :biggthumb according to the friend, who has met with the accused scientist twice during the past two months.
On the basis of Khan’s claims, Beg and another former army chief of staff, Gen. Jehangir Karamat, who occupied the post from 1996 to 1998, have been questioned by investigators in recent days, but both have denied any knowledge of the transactions, according to a senior Pakistani military officer who spoke on condition of anonymity.**
Qazi Hussain Ahmed talked with A.Q.Khan on the phone and he quotes A.Q.Khan as saying that he didn't sign any statement regarding his role in the nuclear proliferation. He says its a hoax. Source: Ary One World News interview with Qazi Hussain.
Who cares. The govt will say he signed it and prevent him from making statements.
What's one small lie in an entire sea of lies.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Khilaari: *
Who cares. The govt will say he signed it and prevent him from making statements.
What's one small lie in an entire sea of lies.
[/QUOTE]
Then there is the rumored video tape smuggled out of the country. The govt. may not allow him to talk to press but whats going to stop his daughter from revealing the truth?