NomiCA
November 14, 2011, 1:54pm
21
Re: Do you think
^my question was general entrance..not limited to hajj/umra…just generally, whether non-muslims were allowed to enter makkah as visitors..
this guy also went undercover (being cited as the first non-muslim to enter)
Ludovico di Varthema, also known as Barthema and Vertomannus (c. 1470-1517) was an Italian traveller and diarist, known for being the first non-Muslim European to enterMecca as a pilgrim . Nearly everything that is known about his life comes from his own account of his travels, Itinerario de Ludouico de Varthema Bolognese, published in Rome in 1510.
this guy visited undercover (which means they weren’t allowed before sauds too)
First explorations and journey to Mecca (1851–1853)http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8f/Richardburtonarabicdress.JPG/150px-Richardburtonarabicdress.JPG http://bits.wikimedia.org/skins-1.18/common/images/magnify-clip.png
Motivated by his love of adventure, Burton got the approval of the Royal Geographical Society for an exploration of the area and he gained permission from the Board of Directors of the British East India Company to take leave from the army. His seven years in India gave Burton a familiarity with the customs and behaviour of Muslims and prepared him to attempt a Hajj (pilgrimage to Mecca and, in this case,Medina ). It was this journey, undertaken in 1853, which first made Burton famous. He had planned it whilst travelling disguised among the Muslims of Sindh, and had laboriously prepared for the ordeal by study and practice (including undergoing the Muslim tradition of circumcision to further lower the risk of being discovered).Hajj (Ludovico de Varthema did this in 1503),[SUP][12]](Richard Francis Burton - Wikipedia )[/SUP] his pilgrimage is the most famous and the best documented of the time. He adopted various disguises including that of a Pashtun to account for any oddities in speech, but he still had to demonstrate an understanding of intricate Islamic ritual , and a familiarity with the minutiae of Eastern manners and etiquette. Burton’s trek to Mecca was dangerous and his caravan was attacked by bandits (a common experience at the time). As he put it, “… neither Koran or Sultan enjoin the death of Jew or Christian intruding within the columns that note the sanctuary limits, nothing could save a European detected by the populace, or one who after pilgrimage declared himself an unbeliever.”[SUP][13]](Richard Francis Burton - Wikipedia )[/SUP] The pilgrimage entitled him to the title of Hajji and to wear green head wrap. Burton’s own account of his journey is given in A Personal Narrative of a Pilgrimage to Al-Medinah and Meccah (1855).Richard Francis Burton - Wikipedia )[/SUP]Richard Francis Burton - Wikipedia )[/SUP]
and then there was this guy…who seems to have visited with special consent or approval or something…
Christiaan Snouck Hurgronje (.mw-parser-output .IPA-label-small{font-size:85%}.mw-parser-output .references .IPA-label-small,.mw-parser-output .infobox .IPA-label-small,.mw-parser-output .navbox .IPA-label-small{font-size:100%}Dutch pronunciation: [ˈkrɪstijaːn ˈsnuk ɦʏrˈɣrɔɲə]; 8 February 1857 – 26 June 1936) was a Dutch scholar of Oriental cultures and languages and advisor on native affairs to the colonial government of the Dutch East Indies.
Born in Oosterhout in 1857, he became a theology...
Snouck, who was fluent in Arabic , through mediation with the Ottoman governor in Jeddah , was examined by a delegation of scholars from Mecca in 1884 and upon successfully completing the examination was allowed to commence a pilgrimage to the Holy Muslim city of Mecca in 1885. He was one of the first Western scholars of Oriental cultures to do so.A pioneering traveler, he was a rare Western presence in Mecca, but embraced the culture and religion of his hosts with passion, converting to Islam.
Aceones
November 14, 2011, 2:12pm
22
Re: Do you think
^^ thanks NomiCA for googling this, so this proves that it was not allowed (all above attempts were either undercover or with special permission not normal cases) even before sauds? but i think its not true.
i can recall reading something about the era of "Nooruddin Zangi" which is in Abbasi Khilafat, the case of how he saw Rassullah (S.A.W.) in dream warning/ giving him some hint about one (two? i cannot recall) jew men who were trying to dig a tunnel upto the Roza-e-mubarak and the related story... they were pretty close to masjid-e-nabwi in their mischievous attempt and they were living in Madina-al-munawwara, means non-muslims were allowed to enter the city (or they were also undercover, i cannot recall the whole event)...
i might try to search more later...
NomiCA
November 14, 2011, 2:22pm
23
Re: Do you think
^ well........this was just some stuff i remember reading about.... so.......i don't think that it is only the sauds that did it........restriction had been there before too.......... exact timing of any lack of restrictions i don't know..