Re: Army ordered to hit back at cross-border attackers
only 2 options left
1. take em head on, which in my view is a lost cause
2. get tactical like Musharraf, more speaches(lectures), less action
Re: Army ordered to hit back at cross-border attackers
I think...Pakistan should occupy the adjecent area ( Afghan side) to Wazirstan to control the situation... :)
Re: Army ordered to hit back at cross-border attackers
Is army bechari nay kia counter attack karna hay ye to surf apni awam ko mar sakti hay!!
Re: Army ordered to hit back at cross-border attackers
^ what will that do? People are charging Islamabad to control jihadis inside Pakistan today, so adding territory will only make it a even bigger problem.
You have to realize something - Pakistan is being accused of being the problem creator here and hence the moral position taken by USA and others that it is ok to attack inside the border. Remember India used to call Pakistan a terrorist state? They couldn't prove it but some elements within Pakistan have done that effectively for them!
Sometimes you have to wonder if there is such a thing as nation, pride, shame in these people of power in Pakistan. What else can you say when Condi's driver is able to accost PM Ghilani with videos and tapes of ISI Al Qaeda conversations, knowing ISI is supposed to report to the PM?
Frankly speaking, and it may be hurtful but has to be faced - ever since Musharraf's star began to wane, I think Washington has demoted Pakistan from banana state to rotten banana state - just look at the insult laden statements being made by Bush and Mullen and their deputy assistant peons even commanding highest officials of Pakistan to this and that! If this is in public, imagine what it'd be in private! I bet Ghilani never thought he'd have to salute minimum wage officials of D.C when he was made PM!
Singh, PM of India is invited to White House for ceremonial dinner when he decides to visit USA post NSG, obviously in a clever attempt to pressure congress to put aside all wrangling and pass the nukes for India bill in record timem....9ontrast this with Ghilani's visit - he was left stranded by the plane without an umbrella, forget red carpet.
Re: Army ordered to hit back at cross-border attackers
This seems like nothing more than empty hot air - The News' attempt at creating sensation.
Nothing of the sort is mentioned in any of ISPR press releases on its website as of Sept 12. So calm down people.
News obviously stretched the statement Pakistan's military commanders resolved to defend the country's borders and added the mirch masala part on its own *The Pakistan Army has been ordered to retaliate against any action by foreign troops inside the country *
I think...Pakistan should occupy the adjecent area ( Afghan side) to Wazirstan to control the situation... :)
Hi ..
My dear brothers n sisters in pakistan
I really think that this war should end now ..
everyone should do "Nice nice to each other "
Pakistan Afganistan and US should organise a Feat together wherein a lot of Food n chiken n all good buffet system should be organised
so that everybody will be happy after eating good stuff n then this will put an end to whatsoever fight was there
I think the dishes on offer should include
1.Chiken manchurian
2.Pork pepperoni
3.sweetcorn soup
4.Casa Blanca rum
5.Smirnoff Vodka
6.Lasssi
7.Paan
Howz this idea dudes????
Hi ..
My dear brothers n sisters in pakistan I really think that this war should end now .. everyone should do "Nice nice to each other " Pakistan Afganistan and US should organise a Feat together wherein a lot of Food n chiken n all good buffet system should be organised so that everybody will be happy after eating good stuff n then this will put an end to whatsoever fight was there I think the dishes on offer should include 1.Chiken manchurian 2.Pork pepperoni 3.sweetcorn soup 4.Casa Blanca rum 5.Smirnoff Vodka 6.Lasssi 7.Paan
Howz this idea dudes????
LOL...
Although you have clarified that buffet system should be adopted to serve the above mentioned menu...just putting these things on the table will start world war three immediately in Waziristan...
LOL...
Although you have clarified that buffet system should be adopted to serve the above mentioned menu...just putting these things on the table will start world war three immediately in Waziristan...
My dear brother Yazdi,
First of all greetings to u
a "Nice Nice" Hug from me .
U seem to think from a different angle.
why will it start a world war my brother we shall take care of that na we shall clean up a nice area from waziristan put a nice bamboo shack over there
clean up the place so that the sick place shall be clear of all the mosquitos n leaches n cowdungs n camels n piggies n doggies then after cleaning the place we shall have a nice party out there brother
When all the 3 warring parties know each other pretty well n party out there then then there wont be any cause for war when the things can be sorted out nicely
Interesting that our valiant PM said yesterday that we Pakistanis can protest to their aggression but can't go to war, lol. And the same day US went for another strike in FATA. Congratulations Mir Jafar!
^ what will that do? People are charging Islamabad to control jihadis inside Pakistan today, so adding territory will only make it a even bigger problem.
You have to realize something - Pakistan is being accused of being the problem creator here and hence the moral position taken by USA and others that it is ok to attack inside the border. Remember India used to call Pakistan a terrorist state? They couldn't prove it but some elements within Pakistan have done that effectively for them!
Sometimes you have to wonder if there is such a thing as nation, pride, shame in these people of power in Pakistan. What else can you say when Condi's driver is able to accost PM Ghilani with videos and tapes of ISI Al Qaeda conversations, knowing ISI is supposed to report to the PM?
Frankly speaking, and it may be hurtful but has to be faced - ever since Musharraf's star began to wane, I think Washington has demoted Pakistan from banana state to rotten banana state - just look at the insult laden statements being made by Bush and Mullen and their deputy assistant peons even commanding highest officials of Pakistan to this and that! If this is in public, imagine what it'd be in private! I bet Ghilani never thought he'd have to salute minimum wage officials of D.C when he was made PM!
Singh, PM of India is invited to White House for ceremonial dinner when he decides to visit USA post NSG, obviously in a clever attempt to pressure congress to put aside all wrangling and pass the nukes for India bill in record timem....9ontrast this with Ghilani's visit - he was left stranded by the plane without an umbrella, forget red carpet.
Pakistanis deserve this insult and humiliation. They haven't shown self respect from the day one since 9/11/2001. They became the part of terror with US on their brethren and invited hell for themselves. FATA was not as it is today. Our crimes have turned them furious, they will burn us to ashes if we keep behaving like hypocrites.
Cuba and Venezuella are small nations but quite sovereign and respectable, unlike us.
I think we should hand over our nukes along with AQ Khan to the Mighty US, as both them are useless and the root of all evil.
I like this word “domestic consumption”.**
Higher-tech Predators targeting Pakistan**
The U.S. drone aircraft involved in strikes against Taliban and Al Qaeda militants across the border have enhanced tracking ability.
By Greg Miller and Julian E. Barnes, Los Angeles Times Staff Writers
September 12, 2008
WASHINGTON -- As part of an escalating offensive against extremist targets in Pakistan, the United States is deploying Predator aircraft equipped with sophisticated new surveillance systems that were instrumental in crippling the insurgency in Iraq, according to U.S. military and intelligence officials.
The use of the specially equipped drones comes amid a fundamental shift in U.S. strategy in the area. After years of deferring to Pakistani authorities, the Bush administration is turning toward unilateral American military operations – a gambit that could increase pressure on Islamic militants but risks alienating a country that has been a key counter-terrorism ally.
In an indication of the priority being given to the Pakistan campaign, U.S. officials said the specially equipped aircraft were being pulled from other theaters to augment aerial patrols above the tribal belt along Afghanistan’s eastern border.
Pakistan’s government has found itself caught between Washington’s demands for action and the unpopularity of the U.S. campaign, which has included half a dozen Predator strikes and a ground raid in the last few weeks.
This morning, witnesses said, at least eight people were believed killed in what appeared to be a Predator strike in North Waziristan, near the Afghan border.
Pakistanis complain that U.S. raids frequently kill civilians in addition to militants.
Pakistani forces also are carrying out their own campaign against the militants, and say they have killed hundreds in the last month, making the U.S. raids unnecessary.
American officials requested that details of the new technology not be disclosed out of concern that doing so might enable militants to evade U.S. detection. But officials said the previously unacknowledged devices have become a powerful part of the American arsenal, allowing the tracking of human targets even when they are inside buildings or otherwise hidden from Predator surveillance cameras.
Equally important, officials said, the systems have significantly speeded up decisions on when to strike. The technology gives remote pilots a means beyond images from the Predator’s lens of confirming a target’s identity and precise location.
A military official familiar with the systems said they had a profound effect, both militarily and psychologically, on the Sunni Arab insurgency in Iraq.
“It is like they are living with a red dot on their head,” said a former U.S. military official familiar with the technology who, like others, spoke on condition of anonymity because it has been secret. “With the quietness of the Predator, you never knew when a Hellfire [missile] would come through your window.”
The new Predator capabilities are a key ingredient in an emerging U.S. military offensive against Taliban strongholds and Al Qaeda havens in Pakistan.
Previously, the United States’ main focus in Pakistan’s tribal territory was gathering intelligence that could be used to direct raids by the Pakistani military, or occasional missile strikes from CIA-operated Predator planes.
Intelligence activities will increasingly be geared now toward enabling U.S. Special Forces units – backed by AC-130 gunships and other aircraft – to carry out operations against Taliban and Al Qaeda operatives, officials said.
The change in strategy reflects frustration within the Bush administration over Pakistan’s failure to root out insurgent groups or disrupt the flow of militants who launch attacks in Afghanistan and then retreat to Pakistan.
After years of building alliances with local tribes, Al Qaeda and Taliban groups now have a “mature” haven in Pakistan from which to operate, said a senior administration official, who spoke on condition of anonymity.
The New York Times reported Thursday that President Bush signed an order in July authorizing U.S. special operations forces to conduct missions in Pakistan without asking for its permission.
A former senior CIA official said similar proposals had been in circulation as early as 2003. A Pentagon proposal to make wider use of special operations forces in Pakistan was debated for months by the National Security Council, said a government official.
But until this summer, Bush was reluctant to authorize the action in part out of loyalty to former Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf, who was forced from office last month.
At the same time, rising numbers of American troops being killed in Afghanistan caused a shift in thinking among many in the Pentagon. A total of 113 U.S. troops have been killed in the country this year.
In response, the United States has stepped up Predator strikes. But the clearest signal of a new strategy came last week when about 20 people were killed in a raid on the village of Musa Nika by U.S. special operations forces flown by helicopter from Afghanistan.
That operation, and the turn in Bush administration policy, has been condemned by senior Pakistani officials, including the army chief of staff, Gen. Ashfaq Kayani.
Kayani’s statement was his first public criticism of the U.S. military, and his stance on such raids was regarded in Pakistan as a watershed because he had steered clear of politics during his nine months on the job.
Prime Minister Yusaf Raza Gillani issued a statement Thursday saying that government policy forbids American military incursions into Pakistan.
Pentagon officials said they hoped that Kayani’s anger was mainly for domestic consumption, and would not lead to curtailed cooperation with the U.S. military, which depends on access to Pakistani ports to supply operations in Afghanistan.
The new surveillance technology being deployed on the Predators was developed as part of a special project within the CIA’s Directorate of Science and Technology, according to current and former officials familiar with the matter.
The CIA has been responsible for Predator flights over Pakistan but is now being pressured to cede some authority to the U.S. military. The agency declined to discuss details of the program.
“It’s a poor idea, with American forces engaged in conflicts overseas, to speculate publicly about things like battlefield reconnaissance capabilities,” CIA spokesman Paul Gimigliano said.
Predator strikes were used in attacks that killed Al Qaeda military commander Mohammed Atef in Afghanistan in 2001 and Qaed Sinan Harithi, a suspected mastermind of the bombing of the U.S. destroyer Cole, in Yemen in 2002.
However, Predators have also frequently missed their targets, including a high-profile attempt to attack Al Qaeda No. 2 Ayman Zawahiri in 2006. They have been blamed for the deaths of dozens of civilians in Pakistan, fueling resentment there toward the United States.
The new system now being deployed was first used on aircraft in Afghanistan, then was installed on Predators in Iraq starting about a year ago. Officials said introduction of the devices coincided with the 2007 U.S. troop buildup in Iraq, and was an important, but hitherto unknown, factor in the subsequent drop in violence in that country.
The technology allows suspects to be identified quickly. “All I have to do is point the sensor at him,” said a military officer familiar with the system, “and a missile can be off the rail in seconds.”
The devices are roughly the size of an automobile battery, but are heavy enough that outfitted Predators in some cases carry only one Hellfire missile instead of two. At times, the systems also have been in short supply, requiring that crews move the devices from one Predator to another as they land and take off.
The unique capabilities have prompted competition among U.S. forces for access to specially equipped Predators, military officials said. The fleet being assembled for use in Pakistan has been assigned to the CIA and U.S. Special Operations Command, meaning fewer of the aircraft are available for conventional forces.
Military officials noted that Predators’ effectiveness declines as the winter months approach. Bad weather, especially in the high altitudes of the Afghan and Pakistani mountains, means that many days Predators and other drones cannot fly.
Those elements were / are sent into Pakistan by india. That lal masjid episode and suicide bombings across the major cities of Pakistan. Do you really believe that mullah who tried to run away in burka was a native pakistani? Do you have any idea how easy it is to obtain a Pakistani passport? Or replace a Pakistani citizen with a foreign to cause things such as lal masjid? No doubt poor security arrangments made it so very easy for these 'elements' to act like the terrorists who were born, trained in Pakistan itself.
It seems that the CIA is fighting the indian war with pakistan after it is done fighting the israeli war with palestinian people. It is unfortunate though how easy it is to brainwash the US government. Or do they really love being brainwashed? CIA is persuing india's dream of attacking, destablizing Pakistan. Why??? This is NOT a 'war on terror' anymore. OBL is NOT alongside the Pakistan / Afghan border and they KNOW it. But they want to continue bombing Pakistan as per indian wish by making OBL's presence an excuse? Why??? CIA has distorted image of US in the world by dancing on the finger tips of other countries who are using it. Why are they doing this to themselves?
While US fight india's war with pakistan, India, on the other hand, wants to forever give out the image of the most 'peace-loving', 'free of terror', heaven for tourists land. They do not want to come to the llimelight and be exposed as the country most 'itched' by Pakistan's existance. They let US take that blame. Very clever indeed.
It's time to say no though. No more fcuking around on Pakistani soil, anymore. It's time to save our people from these *'snakes' *who bite from the back but smile on the face.
We'll die but with honor.
You have to realize something - Pakistan is being accused of being the problem creator here and hence the moral position taken by USA and others that it is ok to attack inside the border. Remember India used to call Pakistan a terrorist state? They couldn't prove it but some elements within Pakistan have done that effectively for them!
Those elements were / are sent into Pakistan by india. That lal masjid episode and suicide bombings across the major cities of Pakistan. Do you really believe that mullah who tried to run away in burka was a native pakistani? Do you have any idea how easy it is to obtain a Pakistani passport? Or replace a Pakistani citizen with a foreign to cause things such as lal masjid? No doubt poor security arrangments made it so very easy for these 'elements' to act like the terrorists who were born, trained in Pakistan itself.
That Mullah is a Pakistani, his father was a Pakistani who helped Zia recruit "mujahideen" for Afghan "jihad" and thus got an status which made all the next govts to turn blind eye towards him and family till the point of operation last year.
By challenging his citizenship you are saying that Paksitanis can't be brainwashed into taking extreme measures in the name of Islam? I have friends who at one point were brainwashed by his friends when Sipahe Sahaba was being formed and he had started to believe them. After a while he parted ways when he realized that his friends are wrong and stayed away from SSP while his friends are still with SSP. We can either become pigeons and close our eyes thinking there is no danger or face the danger.
Ziaul Haq messed up the nation by selective teaching of Islam in high-school curriculum of "Jihaad" verses, he simply laid the foundation of extremism and no-one could remove it from then onwards. Likes of Jamate Islami and other "religous" organizations recruited students to participate in every "jihaad" for everyone else.
It seems that** the CIA is fighting the indian war with pakistan** after it is done fighting the israeli war with palestinian people. It is unfortunate though how easy it is to brainwash the US government. Or do they really love being brainwashed? CIA is persuing india's dream of attacking, destablizing Pakistan. Why??? This is NOT a 'war on terror' anymore. OBL is NOT alongside the Pakistan / Afghan border and they KNOW it. But they want to continue bombing Pakistan as per indian wish by making OBL's presence an excuse? Why??? CIA has distorted image of US in the world by dancing on the finger tips of other countries who are using it. Why are they doing this to themselves?
CIA is fighting Israeli war with Pakistan (nukes nukes), not Indian war. Indian lobby is not as strong as Israeli lobby and US loves Israel while the relationship with India is "enemy of enemy is friend" (Hint: Countering China).
Re: Army ordered to hit back at cross-border attackers
Ambassador, your theories are absurd seriously, that mollah in burqa was prolly more Pakistani than you and me are, his ancestors, and himself lived entirely in Pakistan. Whether or not his idealogy was correct or wrong is a different subject, but its absurd saying hes working for America, Israel and India.
Just face it, Musharraf gave total control of Pakistan to the US for ecnomic aid, and now the present Govt has no choice but to continue this policy. Those crying about the loss of our soverign status back then were brutally silenced by the corrupt, tyrant and dictatorial regime. Musharraf messed up big time, he not only let the coalition in, but he made sure the extremists that the coalition were fighting were well taken care of and nurtured, so the need to have him in power stays. Because of this, these extremists are powerful, whereas the coalition will continue to pound on them heavily, in Pakistan. Bottomline, ordinary and innocent Pakistanis will continue to suffer and die.
Spooky, I request you to kindly NOT read my theories just like I prefer ignoring your moronic substance-less statements. Thank you very much.
Spooky, I request you to kindly NOT read my theories just like I prefer ignoring your moronic substance-less statements. Thank you very much.
Then dont put those moronic substance less theories up on this public discussion board, if youre so scared of the criticism.
- By challenging his citizenship, all I am saying is that, if you were living in Pakistan all your life with your family, and myself, out of any motive of my own, decide to, through using 'my contacts' in Pakistan, replace you with your look alike who would 'try' to behave like you. But a little weird that would slightly puzzle your family but they would not care much as you had 'some' inclinations of that behaviour. Can you tell me for sure that I cannot do that in Pakistan?
The mullah was more of an 'actor' than an actual mullah. All that drama to declare to the world through international media why it is necessary to extend the Iraq's and then Afghanistan's war to Pakistan. If this concept is too thick for you, you have a long way to go to know the ABC of the political world.
Agree with the ziul haq part. He did manage to make Pakistan's defence system stronger (highly unliked by Pakistan's enemies) but definitely basing that on an 'Islamism' was the most ridiculous thing he ever did. The foundation should have been PAKISTAN rather than ISLAM [precisely because muslims (especially mullahs), do not know follow Islam, actually, but presume that they do].
I have no doubts that it is indian lobby getting their way (for US war with Pakistan) through using, exploiting, brain-washing whatever lobby has the control of CIA and the US government. It is easier for them because our mullahs want to kill all the 'jewish' borns. So it is easier for indians to exploit CIA to do what they are doing with Pakistan. 'War on terror' is made the foundation here to accomplish the interests of more than one parties (the indian interest of dividing Pakistan and merging it back with them included) than just eliminating the terrorism.
That Mullah is a Pakistani, his father was a Pakistani who helped Zia recruit "mujahideen" for Afghan "jihad" and thus got an status which made all the next govts to turn blind eye towards him and family till the point of operation last year.
**By challenging his citizenship **you are saying that Paksitanis can't be brainwashed into taking extreme measures in the name of Islam? I have friends who at one point were brainwashed by his friends when Sipahe Sahaba was being formed and he had started to believe them. After a while he parted ways when he realized that his friends are wrong and stayed away from SSP while his friends are still with SSP. We can either become pigeons and close our eyes thinking there is no danger or face the danger.
Ziaul Haq messed up the nation by selective teaching of Islam in high-school curriculum of "Jihaad" verses, he simply laid the foundation of extremism and no-one could remove it from then onwards. Likes of Jamate Islami and other "religous" organizations recruited students to participate in every "jihaad" for everyone else.
CIA is fighting Israeli war with Pakistan (nukes nukes), not Indian war. Indian lobby is not as strong as Israeli lobby and US loves Israel while the relationship with India is "enemy of enemy is friend" (Hint: Countering China).
dont know if this has been posted before in the forum
Very interesting read… After 7 years of dance in Afghanistan and they could not control pashtuns.. When Amerika started pointing finger at Pak that is when I was absolutely sure it has lost in Afganistan and now wants to divert attention…
Masters of Defeat: Retreating Empire and Bellicose Bluster
South Asia
In South Asia, the US strategic puppet ruler, Pakistani dictator Mushareff has been forced to resign – and the weak and divided electoral coalition which has replaced him has not been able to match the military, diplomatic and intelligence support for the US war in Afghanistan which Mushareff provided. The Pakistan-Afghan border is virtually open territory for cross border attacks, recruitment and military supplies by Afghan resistance organizations. The empire’s loss of Mushareff further undermines US efforts to impose an outpost in Afghanistan.
Through frequent ground and air attacks on Pakistan regions bordering Afghanistan, the US-NATO ‘coalition’ has multiplied, deepened and made massive civilian political and armed opposition throughout the country. The ‘election’ of the US client and convicted warlord and thug, Asif Ali Zadari, as President of Pakistan, will not in anyway contribute to the recovery of US influence outside of very limited elite political and military circles. Washington’s pursuit and extension of military imperialism from Afghanistan to Pakistan has led to even more severe political defeat among a much wider population in South Asia.
Top NATO generals and officials have recognized that the ‘Taliban’ has reorganized and extended its influence throughout the country, controlling most throughways to the major cities and even operating in and around the capital Kabul. Repeated US bombing and missile strikes of civilian housing, cultural events and markets have alienated vast numbers of Afghans and led to widespread opposition to US client ruler Karzai. The promises of both US presidential candidates to vastly expand the US occupation forces in Afghanistan upon taking office, will only prolong the war and deepen the weakening of the economic empires and its domestic foundations.
Through frequent ground and air attacks on Pakistan regions bordering Afghanistan, the US-NATO ‘coalition’ has multiplied, deepened and made massive civilian political and armed opposition throughout the country. The ‘election’ of the US client and convicted **warlord **and thug, Asif Ali Zadari, as President of Pakistan, will not in anyway contribute to the recovery of US influence outside of very limited elite political and military circles. Washington’s pursuit and extension of military imperialism from Afghanistan to Pakistan has led to even more severe political defeat among a much wider population in South Asia.
Zardari is a warlord? I didn't know..... bhai iss ko bolo thori halki chhoray.