Plan=Oppose anything the US does or says. Contribute nothing positive. Whine a lot, and justify killings of Jews and intentional targeting of innocents.
Funny thing. During the lead up to the war in Afghanistan we heard how the US would just bomb away, but never have a soldier on the ground. Then we heard that everything would become a a quagmire. Now we are doing a body count day by day hoping that Iraq has become Somalia. And how can a country that is being GIVEN 87Billion be liberated “for the oil?”.
Maybe no one heard this, but most Americans KNEW that Iraq was a brutal place, and that urban fighting was dangerous. The politically incorrect point I was making before is that America seems to be absorbing the casualties quite well. The economy is booming, and is a similar political case. Bush kept insisting that all of the pieces were in place for economic growth. Finally the third quarter economy surges at an annualized rate of more than 7%. Iraq will follow the same blueprint. A solution is in place, we don’t know how long it will take to work, but it will work. This will be the Administrations “sell” on Iraq. So far Bush’s populatity has sunk back only to “normal” levels, which is not at all unexpected. If the economy continues to grow, jobs are added, and by the secoond half of '04 the troop count in Iraq is going down, then Bush will be re-elected handily.
The day by day swings in the news flow have very little to do with the eventual outcome in Iraq. So long as the North and South are stable and getting better, the US will be able to focus more and more forces on the Sunni triangle. The casualties taken by the US are painful, but by historic standards are quite small. Those casualties, as they currently stand are not going to change policy.
**Originally posted by Ohioguy: *
... The politically incorrect point I was making before is that America seems to be absorbing the casualties quite well.*
No wonder public is questioning Bush more about Iraq handling
*The economy is booming, and is a similar political case. Bush kept insisting that all of the pieces were in place for economic growth. Finally the third quarter economy surges at an annualized rate of more than 7%. Iraq will follow the same blueprint. *
And that some billions of dollars provided to public ($400 per child) for spending had nothing to do with the 7%?
*If the economy continues to grow, jobs are added, and by the secoond half of '04 the troop count in Iraq is going down, then Bush will be re-elected handily. *
Even if economy goes down in '04 Bush can be re-elected as long as he can keep the fire or enemy alive to be held/killed during that time ;)
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Ohioguy: *
The day by day swings in the news flow have very little to do with the eventual outcome in Iraq. So long as the North and South are stable and getting better, the US will be able to focus more and more forces on the Sunni triangle. The casualties taken by the US are painful, but by historic standards are quite small. Those casualties, as they currently stand are not going to change policy.
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I think that many people still simply do not get the big picture about how many/the majority of Americans feel. Yes, we mourn and feel pain for every American serviceman or servicewoman who dies while discharging their duty. But, in the two years plus since the unholy attack on our citizens by Al Qaeda, we have lost far less soldiers than that single attack on our turf caused. It is better that the battlefield is "over there" and being fought by trained military personnel rather than being waged here at home against people going about their daily lives.
No one will win a national election on a platform that it is better to sit back waiting for the next attack to come in the USA. No one will win an election on a platform to just cut and run from Iraq or Afghanistan leaving it to fester/foster more terrorism. The lack of a clear winning exit strategy at the present time does trouble most of us but not as much as we would be troubled had we had no winning entry strategy. For many of us, the celebratory mood and glee we see exhibited every time an American is killed merely increases our resolve, demonstrates that we are doing the proper thing and countenances more patience. In fact, many times getting a good dose of anti-Americanism on Gupshup reinvigorates even me erasing any and all doubts I might be having about the path we as a nation are pursuing.
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*Originally posted by myvoice: *
....
In fact, many times getting a good dose of anti-Americanism on Gupshup reinvigorates even me erasing any and all doubts I might be having about the path we as a nation are pursuing.
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*Originally posted by underthedome: *
$65 billion for military personnel and operations in Iraq and Afghanistan, and an additional $18.6 billion for reconstruction efforts in Iraq.
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So all of $87bn is not for the reconstruction of Iraq... :p for the one who said it was.
[QUOTE] Originally posted by Ohioguy: *
**And how can a country that is being GIVEN 87Billion be liberated "for the oil?*
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That makes it sound as though $87 billion will be given STRAIGHT into the hands of every Iraqi child, man, and woman. How is this $87 billion actually going to be distributed throughout the country? Which govt'l departments are getting it? Is it the oil industries? Where is the money being invested into? What are the names of the hospitals that will receive a portion of this money? How many orphanages? How many schools will be reconstructed, and in which parts of Iraq are those schools located? Just like during the sanctions era, i hope that more money and "reconstruction" is not being diverted towards the northern Kurdish regions of Iraq, but will also be funnelled towards the southern nonKurdish areas of Iraq.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Ohioguy: *
Plan=Oppose anything the US does or says. Contribute nothing positive. Whine a lot, and justify killings of Jews and intentional targeting of innocents.
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Really OG, who is justyfying killings of jews. It seems like you are justyfying the occupation of palestanian land. Torture, daily humiliation, house razing and killing of innocent civilians. All Muslims want is a fair and balanced policy. When you can open your eyes to the unfair treatment of the palestanians only then you will be able to see their side.
Can you honestly say that Afghanistan is a better place now? Or let me ask you this Did George W. Bush accomplish his stated goal "we will smoke them out, get them on the run and bring them to justice" Who are "they"?, Where have "they" gone?. I assume he wa stalking about Osama and Mullah Omar...last I checked they were both alive (according to the reports). We will not go into the details of what a mess Afghansitan is right now. Lets move on to Iraq.....stated goal" Make world a safer place"...really... Where are the WMDS that were threat not only to US but the whole Mid-east region? How exactly did world become a safer place after US attacked Iraq? Do you care to shed some light on that. Please dont start to tell me how evil Saddam was... I know that.. I say good riddance, oh wait, I cannot say that, he is not dead yet. Anyway he needed to go, but it could have been accomplished without wasting yours and mine Tax dollars.
Iraq got $18.6 billion for rebuilding, but Afghanistan was allocated only $1.2 billion even though, as The Economist newsmagazine said this week, “Afghanistan has more people, more pressing needs and fewer resources of its own.” Afghanistan has roughly 3.5 million more people than Iraq with no natural resources to rival Iraq’s huge oil reserves.
Incidentally, the $65bn that's going on military operations in Iraq is of direct benefit to the US economy. The bulk of that cost is going on enhanced military hardware for the US army... and guess which country that military hardware will be almost entirely purchased from.... the USA.
The US economy will potentially experience a slight Keynesian boom as the US arms industry picks up, hiring more people, who will spend more on consumer goods, a similar effect to go on in the goods industry, etc.....
Of course, the flip side is the inflationary pressure that will be applied as a result of Americans having and spending more money....
