^ agree mostly with Shikra, i dont understand girls who wear hijab and wear clothes that r literally stuck to their skin.
However, sharam/ haya is not limited to your eyes (it may include it though), if it was, then the quran wouldn't have told the "believing women" to cover themselves so that they may distinguish themselves from the woman of zamana- e- jahiliya. Our deen has installed that sharam/ haya has to be done by covering up our selves in the manner which pleases Allah SWT.
Why wasn’t she accepted as a hijabi? Did the school just have a “no hijab” policy? or were they just not qualified? B/c not being qualified and wearing the hijab are totally un-related and it makes no sense to make a correlation between the two.
And why shouldn’t they talk about thier involvement in their community?? Since when did that become a taboo subject to put on school/job applications? As far as I know, these type of skills and experience are looked favorably upon on all types of applications. Maybe all those hours at Sunday school, teaching or learning, helped them manage thier time and energy better? Or all that exposure to the people in the neighborhood made the applicant realize how beneficial it would be to have a lawyer/doctor in their community? So, yeah, all that involvement, if it helped them establish the necessary skills to endure in the real working world, they have all the right to include it on their applications w/o being seen as “harp[ing] up [their] religion”..
Right, so it’s NOT okay for a Muslim girl to talk about her relevant experience on any application but it’s perfectly alright for someone to mention they want to be a Christian missionariy? Not saying that the missionairies are in any way worse, but why is it okay for medical school faculties to be sympathetic to evangelicals but not to muslim women who wear the hijab?
I’m sure there’s lots of it from non-Muslims, but it’s absolutely sad when that Islamophobia comes from Muslims themselves.
Again, did they get into those schools b/c of those hijabs? Or b/c of their credentials?? Are htey immature and have bad personalities B/C of their hijab? Sheesh. By attributing pretty much every action to their hijab, you’re just reducing them to the clothing they wear…and that’s exactly the opposite of what hijab is supposed to be.
Look like idiots how? by refusing to shake hands? By not joining them for drinks? By not being buddy-buddy with their male employees? If one is passionate about working but their comfort level does not allow for those things then what, they should quit working
I kinda agree with PCG. I would like to add 1 thing though, based on my personal experience, and I don't mean to offend the ladies here:
Sharam/Haya should be in your eyes, not in hijab. I have seen girls who don't wear hijab but they are really good girls (pray, don't have b/fs etc.) and I have also seen girls who wear hijab but also wear tight sweat pants, tight shirts, and have relationships with boys. The purpose of hijab is not to simply hide hair but to practice modesty. Just because you wear hijab but show every other piece of body, that doesn't make you any better than a non-hijabi who wears lose clothes and minds her own business and doesn't mix with boys.
I agree w/ you too but at the same time, it's kinda not fair to just attribute everything to someone who wears a scarf, though by far it never makes them better than anyone else or a stricter follower than a person not wearing hijab..i make no sense :(
^ actually u kinda do.... hijab is a part of the muslimahs personality, it is by no means the ONLY part... if a hijabi wears a scarf, but does every other thing that the Deen of Allah SWT forbids her to, then no she is not better then any.
on the other hand, the arguement that i do so many sins and am gonna wait till i get rid of all of them b4 wearing a scarf is just as wrong... no guarentee we'll live till tomorrow so lets do as much as we can now inshallah.
^ agree mostly with Shikra, i dont understand girls who wear hijab and wear clothes that r literally stuck to their skin.
However, sharam/ haya is not limited to your eyes (it may include it though), if it was, then the quran wouldn't have told the "believing women" to cover themselves so that they may distinguish themselves from the woman of zamana- e- jahiliya. Our deen has installed that sharam/ haya has to be done by covering up our selves in the manner which pleases Allah SWT.
Wassalam
I never said it was limited to. And I agree, they should observe what Quran has commanded them but my point was just because someone wears scarf, that doesn't make them a better person (well in Allah's eyes it may, we don't know) than a non-hijabi. Sure the non-hijabi isn't following the command but then again, just because hijabi is following the commanda, that doesn't mean she should ignore other parts. i.e. wear lose clothes and don't reveal the shape of your body parts.
I agree w/ you too but at the same time, it's kinda not fair to just attribute everything to someone who wears a scarf, though by far it never makes them better than anyone else or a stricter follower than a person not wearing hijab..i make no sense :(
You are right, and that's what I said in my post above to Pinks. We have heard so many such examples but I'll share one here:
A man once sat down and stuck a dry branch in the ground and started praying next to it. Another man passed by and asked him what he was doing. Man1 said he's praying and hoping that Allah will forgive his sins. If this dry branch turns green, that means Allah has forgiven me and my prayers have been answered/accepted. Man2 found it interesting and did the say; he also started praying.
A few minutes later, they heard a baby cry. Man2 said to man1 "did you hear a baby cry? we should go help the baby". Man1 said "shhhhh, continue praying and don't disturb me". Man2 still got up and gave some water to the baby and the baby stopped crying. When man2 came back by his branch to continue praying, his branch had turned green while man1's branch was still dry.
My point being: Only Allah knows who's better than whom. Sure hijab is following Allah's command but to cover your hair and at the same time reveal your body parts by wearing tight clothes is wrong. In my opinion, the girl who is not observing hijab but is wearing lose clothes and covering her body parts is better than the one observing hijab. This is my personal opinion, Allah knows best.
Do what you feel is best. If you wear the hijab, just don't make us muslims look like idiots when you represent us with your religious garb. You just make it harder for everyone else that way.
People find out what religion you are, one way or the other. So really, this applies just as well to you or myself, as to any Hijabi or beard-wallah out there.
There are still LOADS of people who still don't make the connection between Islam and the Hijab anyway...so really, the Hijab aside, let's all strive to not make fools out of ourselves in the workplace, lest we make life dificult for others in our community.
So, yeah, all that involvement, if it helped them establish the necessary skills to endure in the real working world, they have all the right to include it on their applications w/o being seen as "harp[ing] up [their] religion"..
The key is relevance, I suppose. When I look at a resume, I really don't care for community service of any kind. But that's just the nature of the position I'm trying to fill...
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Right, so it's NOT okay for a Muslim girl to talk about her relevant experience on any application but it's perfectly alright for someone to mention they want to be a Christian missionariy?
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I think the point was, they can get away with it...it's culturally accepted here, whereas Muslims...let's face it...we're just not there yet. It's neither okay or fair...but it's something to be aware of.
Gals, its not a big deal here. Or it shouldnt be. You show up to work in clean and appropriate clothing and do your job. Thats what will move you forward. As far as making a big deal of it, talking up your religion, your involvement in it etc well thats another story. DO YOUR JOB and do it WELL. Play the corporate games that you need to play - ie., join your colleagues for the occasional lunch and/or holiday party and be very polite when you cannot practice common types of corporate things such as handshake. No one CARES really if you are a Hijaabi, they care about getting the job done.
I have never seen a Hijaabi at my work. But I DID see african american women who had to put that in your face. More than a couple of these. When you try to put something "in the face", you will hit a glass ceiling instantly. The ones who do their work and do it well, no matter WHAT color they are or what they wear, those are the ones seen, noticed and appreciated by those far up the ladder. And will get the bigger bonuses and promotions more quickly than others for the simple reason of being able to fit in nicely even with very different values and beleifs - the whole cultural diversity/acceptance thing. It looks GREAT for a company to advance a person like this, but they will be very careful not to advance an "in the face" type.
is it easy to land a professional job for someone who observes an Hijab...and how does one get treated at interviews and workplaces...?
I wear a hijab....i havent completed my bachelors yet and haven't started looking around for work or anything...but i plan to work sometime in the future...so i m trying to find out what to expect...
A lot depends on how well you perform at the interview and who the interviewer is.
do u all notice or is it just me , hijabis are more criticised for their tight clothes rather than being appreciated for their covered heads. on the other hand gurls with un - covered heads are merely picked upon just caz they wear comparatively loose clothes
both are right n wrong in their distinct ways, but shudnt hijabis be appreciated for waht they r following and only being condemned of waht they r not doing ?as far as i know covering hair has much significance in Islam
My mistake in how I wrote out my first sentence. They weren’t rejected BECAUSE they were hijaabis, as far as they were told. What I meant was that every hijabi I know who applied to professional school did get rejected, and either dropped the idea and got married, did something else, or went overseas for further schooling. Whether it was because they were hijaabis or just weak applicants, I don’t know. I’m just reporting a trend.
Secondly, I don’t agree with this business of counting your “missionary” aspirations as a plus point on a student’s application for medical school. But again, I’m reporting something I’ve seen quite often, and its mainly because of the Christian sympathies that some med school faculty harbor. Of course, no one goes screaming about it. Its one of those things that gets brushed under a rug. Its the same thing with the Jewish population. There are some schools that are very nice about giving Jewish applicants a chance. Depends on who runs the school. No one talks about it, and you’ll never be told that you were rejected because you’re a muslim (and chances are, really that wasn’t the main reason anyway), but that doesn’t mean favoritism for other races and ethnicities doesn’t exist.
Managing of time and energy, etc are all basic skills, and if you need to design your resume to reflect those sorts of skills, then you’ve got way more issues to be worried about than whether or not that hijab is going to get in your way of getting into professional school. These schools look for intense skills that the vast majority of applicants probably do not have, and a characteristic personality that they can work with and mold. Working at a sunday school teaching wont get you those skills. If its law school, you need to work on debating skills and get an internship or a job in the industry that maybe shows your professionalism and leadership. Its one thing to stand in front of a group of muslim school kids and teach them about the Prophet’s life when they’re more intent on smacking each other and playing games. Its another to get a group of self-centered egoists at a law firm to listen to you and follow your leadership. Just to give you an idea, I took time off from school and taught. I taught because that’s the only thing that my degree would let me do that I actually didn’t mind doing, and it gave me extra time to pursue some other hobbies before my life got totally absorbed by prof. school. I was literally told that my application was fabulous, and whether I taught or not made no difference to my acceptance. In fact, I was accepted before I took the teaching job. But, I was told that if my application wasn’t what it was, that teaching job would have done nothing to increase my chances. Teaching in general, whether you’re teaching Islam or history or whatever, isn’t something that makes professional schools sit up and really take notice.
Remember, professional schools give you very specific education and skills. They want to see things on your resume that build you in that direction. Sure, they’ll want to see peripheral things, like your personality. But even the peripheral stuff - they’re fitting that into the picture they create of you which determines whether they think you’ll make it in the field or not.
Its not the same process as applying to college, or more generalized graduate school programs.
I am betting that the reason why you don’t see that many muslim girls in professional school has less to do with their religious affinity, and more to do with the cultures they’re raised in - most muslim cultures do not give their daughters as much freedom.
When you have applicants who are flying around the world doing amazing service projects, or applicants who are living in cities away from their parents to internships and attend IVY leagues and doing research in labs 10 states away, and staying up late at night at their internship offices to work on that marketing presentation…its hard for a desi girl who’s parents insist on driving her to college and keep her busy on weekend dawats to rishta hunt for her to compete with that.
Gals, its not a big deal here. Or it shouldnt be. You show up to work in clean and appropriate clothing and do your job. Thats what will move you forward. As far as making a big deal of it, talking up your religion, your involvement in it etc well thats another story. DO YOUR JOB and do it WELL. Play the corporate games that you need to play - ie., join your colleagues for the occasional lunch and/or holiday party and be very polite when you cannot practice common types of corporate things such as handshake. No one CARES really if you are a Hijaabi, they care about getting the job done.
I have never seen a Hijaabi at my work. But I DID see african american women who had to put that in your face. More than a couple of these. When you try to put something "in the face", you will hit a glass ceiling instantly. The ones who do their work and do it well, no matter WHAT color they are or what they wear, those are the ones seen, noticed and appreciated by those far up the ladder. And will get the bigger bonuses and promotions more quickly than others for the simple reason of being able to fit in nicely even with very different values and beleifs - the whole cultural diversity/acceptance thing. It looks GREAT for a company to advance a person like this, but they will be very careful not to advance an "in the face" type.
Exactly. Mamaof3 speaks of a corporate situation. Law school, and medical school, and pharmacy school, and other professional schools demand the same. They want to know that you can do the job. You might agree with this idea or not, it doesn't matter. That's what the faculty choosing students think, and if you want to get into that school, then that's what you have to cater your resume to.
Fact IS that due to Islamophobia in America, it would be unwise for you to risk filling up your application with Islamic activities, lest someone sitting on the committee sees it and argues against your application. They wont sit there and say "lets not accept them, because they're muslim". They're going to find something else wrong with your application. Or they'll talk another applicant up over you. End result, you'll get rejected or wait-listed.
Again, you don't have to agree with this. But its a fact, and it happens.
There's a reason why they don't have a box in the applications for "Please describe your religious activities". Just try to put yourself in their shoes. Imagine you were sitting on an application committee for Aga Khan Medical College, and there you are looking at an application of a student where their predominant activities are about how they're trying to convert the infidel muslims into Christianity. Maybe you might not hold that against them, but I can guarantee that someone will get disgusted.
I do hijaab and Alhumdulillah I did it while i worked in retail, in a bank and also now in a Fitness Club. Its a part of you, in every way.. so dont worry.. alot of places these days consider the person's character and skills before anything.. the ones that dont.. well i jst walk out sayig that they lost the best opportunity for growth through me.. too bad!!.. Goodluck with everything!!
