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  • Results 1 to 7 of 7
    1. #1

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      jahaan tak maine quraan ko samjhaa hai isse se saaf saaf zahir hai deene islam ki bunyaad sirf aur sirf quran hi hai. magar doosri taraf her mullah yahee bataata hai keh deene islam ki bunyaad quraano sunnat yaa quraano hadis hai yani sirf quraan deene islam ki bunyaad nahin hai.

      main jaanana chahoon ga jo log quraan ke saath saath sunnat yaa hadis ko bhi islam ki bunyaad bataate hen un ke paas dalaail kia kia hen.








      Last edited by Mughal1; 2 Weeks Ago at 10:56 AM.

    2. #2

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      lethal kamikaze's Avatar
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      Peace Mughal1,

      Have you not read/heard/listened the verse of Qur'an "that whoever follows (obey) Prophet he actually followed (obeyed) Almighty Allah".
      Never explain urself to any1 The person who likes u doesn't need it &The person who dislike u won't believe it

    3. #3

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      Quote Originally Posted by lethal kamikaze View Post
      Peace Mughal1,

      Have you not read/heard/listened the verse of Qur'an "that whoever follows (obey) Prophet he actually followed (obeyed) Almighty Allah".
      azeezam kamikaze sb, yes I have but it does not mean what you are taking it to mean. Why not?

      1)It is because the only ruler of this world is Allah not any human being be one messenger of Allah. This is clear message of the quran. It is only and only right of Allah to give law and he has in form of his revelations of which we have the final one ie the quran.

      This is why in deen of islam no human being can rule other human beings. If we accept any other ruler than Allah then we are committing shirk ie we are associating partners with Allah in his kingdom. None has the right to rule even an atom or even its particles other than Allah. He created all things and each and everything belongs to him alone ie even a photon. So no one has any right over anything at all unless given by God himself for his own reason or purpose.

      This means all other verses in the quran from which it may appear to us that anyone else may be our lord or master they need to be interpreted in light of these verses which cannot be challenged no mater what. If we do not do this then we introduce contradictions within the message of the quran.

      2)It is of vital importance to remember that all messengers of Allah were human beings, nothing less nothing more. Human beings are prone to human errors.

      The quran clearly quotes some events regarding messengers of Allah wherein they are criticised for falling short of what God required of them. You can read their stories in the quran. This is why a human being cannot be the standard of perfection instead it is word of Allah that is the standard because it is perfect and not prone to any mistakes or errors.

      Since messengers of Allah did make odd mistakes here and there be it not deliberately including the final messenger of Allah therefore to follow their words and deeds blindly is not consistent with teaching of the quran. They are examples for rest of humanity only in things which they said or did according to the revelation of Allah. Where they ended up making any mistakes we are not supposed to follow them like blind people follow each other. If we follow anyone blindly independent of the quran then we are creating personality cults which lead us to sectarianism.

      Words deen of islam only mean a label or name if we have no basis for it to begin with. If try to give it a base then it has to be the quran alone or we cannot base it upon the quran and sunnah or quran and hadis. The reason is explained already above ie the possibility of a messenger of Allah making a mistake. If we try to interpret the quran which is perfect through the information which is of doubtful origin or is mistaken then we can never end up with proper interpretation of the quran so we cannot have deen of islam to begin with. This is why we must accept the quran as basic source of deen of islam and interpret the quran by the quran in light of real world realities. The very idea that the quran should be interpreted through hadis or sunnah is a wrong idea because other sources themselves depend upon the proper understanding of the quran for their authenticity before they could be used for interpreting the quran. I hope this explanation helps you understand the issue better.

      regards and all the best.




      Last edited by Mughal1; 1 Week Ago at 07:28 AM.

    4. #4
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      My take is Quran IS the Islam. Quran defines what is halal/haram, it provides you the boundaries/basis. For 'how to do the fardh' you can refer to Sunnah. But to look at Sunnah/Ahadith and derive fardh/wajib/makrooh from that is not right.

    5. #5

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      Peace @Mughal1,

      What you wrote above in post #3 , partially I agreed where you haven't singled out Qur'an with Sunnah or Hadith or Prophets/Messengers PBUH. However, I disagree with you, where you just singled out Qur'an from Sunnah or Hadith or Prophets/Messengers PBUH.

      However, still you haven't answered my question at post#2 , in a simple plain easy short brief in understandable language. Rather you post very long post with some relevant / irrelevant videos some of which nothing have to do with my question.

      Will you please answer the question at post #2 is simple befitting manner please, so we as well as other readers may understand?
      Never explain urself to any1 The person who likes u doesn't need it &The person who dislike u won't believe it

    6. #6

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      Quote Originally Posted by Captain1 View Post
      My take is Quran IS the Islam. Quran defines what is halal/haram, it provides you the boundaries/basis. For 'how to do the fardh' you can refer to Sunnah. But to look at Sunnah/Ahadith and derive fardh/wajib/makrooh from that is not right.
      Peace Captain1,

      But Almighty Allah says in Qur'an that when "HE (Almighty Allah) and His Messenger have decided a matter, thereafter we must follow/obey", means to follow what is in Qur'an as well what is in Sunnah/Hadiths.

      What you said (highlighted in red) is against what Almighty Allah says in Qur'an.

      Can you explain?
      Never explain urself to any1 The person who likes u doesn't need it &The person who dislike u won't believe it

    7. #7

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      Quote Originally Posted by lethal kamikaze View Post
      Peace @Mughal1,

      What you wrote above in post #3 , partially I agreed where you haven't singled out Qur'an with Sunnah or Hadith or Prophets/Messengers PBUH. However, I disagree with you, where you just singled out Qur'an from Sunnah or Hadith or Prophets/Messengers PBUH.

      However, still you haven't answered my question at post#2 , in a simple plain easy short brief in understandable language. Rather you post very long post with some relevant / irrelevant videos some of which nothing have to do with my question.

      Will you please answer the question at post #2 is simple befitting manner please, so we as well as other readers may understand?
      azeezam lethal kamikaze sb, you need to understand the fact that God is God and his messenger is his messenger, nothing less and nothing more.

      The real point here is, it is God who wanted to send his message for mankind not messenger of God. The part messenger plays in this scheme is message bearer just to pass on God's message to people.

      By giving the wrong job description of messenger we are turn him into a God instead of God's messenger. The messenger was supposed to deliver message of God as it was ie as he received it from God, without adding anything to it or taking away anything from it.

      After he delivered the message of God as it was, it was then up to people to accept it or reject it. The mistake you are making in trying to understand my explanation is you are not separating the communication chain from the message the chain is supposed to deliver for which the communication chain is set up by God who made sure it worked for his purpose and it does and that is why we have the quran today so many centuries after the messenger of God has gone from this world.

      Think about why God needed to send his message? It was because he wanted to tell mankind why he created them and what they need to do to fulfil plan and purpose of God. The quran explains all this and that is it. This is why the actual framework or structure of deen of islam has to come from the quran alone not from mixed sources particularly when those sources are prone to making mistakes.

      Messengers of God have been making mistakes and that is what the quran itself tells us. For this reason God could not tell us to follow them unconditionally that is why whenever God tells us to follow his messenger it means in things which he did according to the quran to fulfil his God given mission and not absolutely in each everything he said or did. To follow anyone absolutely is impossible because one can never know each and everything about anyone, it is limited by natural limitations how much we can know about anyone, so people who tell us we know each and everything about the messenger of God are not realising what they are saying or claiming about messenger of God. Moreover there are things which messengers of Allah said and did which if we did we will become kaafir therefore it is wrong to say we must follow messenger of God absolutely or unlimitedly. So what is so difficult there to understand if people have learned the knowledge they need to make proper sense of the message in the quran? If they have not learned the needed knowledge to understand the message in the quran properly then they cannot understand any explanation no matter how detailed it is.

      Moreover how can you use a secondary source to interpret the main source if secondary source itself depends upon main source for its qualification? This is why the quran alone has to be foundation of deen of islam. However once we have derived the structure of deen of islam from the quran alone there after we can use all other sources to fill in detailed where need be.

      Furthermore mullahs have misinterpreted the quran by telling us it is a complete code of life instead of telling us we need to extract framework of deen of islam from the quran to form a complete code of life to live by. The quran does not give us a fully worked out constitution and laws for organising human society and regulating it. This is why we do not have ummah as the prophet left behind after its formation on basis of the quran alone. Unless we go back to the quran alone as foundation of deen of islam there is not going to be any ummah in future either.

      regards and all the best.


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